Hi there
When I did my training at college the tutor did mention that normally the buttocks are included in swedish massage. I think she may have done 1 demo right at the beginning of the course, but said we wouldn't be covering it on the course due to privacy of each student.
So i've tended to avoid that area when doing a massage, so I'm wondering whether I should be doing it, as I see quite a few of you seem to. If so, does that mean that clients should have no underwear on?
The tutor also said we should ask male clients to wear shorts and not go up too high on the thigh area. This would make buttock work quite difficult.
Another question related to this as well, do you ask the client if they want an abdominal massge at consultation, or do you automatically include it, or avoid it? Just curious on this one.
Regards
Deb
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
PS (and as a hopefully amusing aside) I was talking about massage to an acquaintance who has had a tough time recently (including husband leaving her) and she told me she had gone to a (male) massage therapist. She said she wanted to be seen in a good light so hunted through her drawers to make sure she was wearing her "sexiest knickers" for the treatment! I told her I didn't think that was strictly necessary. And that it's probably better to wear your oldest unsexiest pair if you are having to have oil rubbed over you!
I suspect her instinct was probably the same one that makes people smile for a camera even when they are in the middle of traumatic or tragic events...
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
I feel sure we've 'fully covered' :Dthis subject now but I have a few recent experiences I wanted to share. Since reading this forum I've been feeling slightly dissapointed at the gap in my training and I have been considering including the buttocks/ and the no underwear option. During this thinking time I have had a few experiences that have put me off.
A few weeks ago during his consultation for massage I had a male client ask if 'i get lots of poeple asking about extras' - the way he phrased this made it clear to me that 'he was asking' but the way he said it also wasn't direct. As I work from home and am alone but for a panic alarm I felt quite alarmed for the first time since starting out. Fortunately I didn't have a confrontation since his medical conditions ruled out the treatment anyway, but he didn't half hang around, he was kinda hard to get rid off. Since then I've felt hyper aware as I feel any female therapist would have.
Also I have some female clients who have either bought vouchers for their hubbies/b'friends to have massage or tried to convince them to come. About half my female clientsstruggle to convince their men to have a massage because 'they're scared' .. what of I'm not quite sure. I've been treating one of these guys for a few months now and his girlfriend was in the other day for a treatment and she told he had said that 'he had got really brave now' apparently he considered brave removing his trousers for the treatment never mind underwear! (of course I do ask clients to remove trousers).
Also some of my female clients have said that their partners are afraid of getting an involuntary erection.
So I've decided to carry on as I am now, leaving underwear on and massaging as much as possible. I'm just not sure my clients are ready for the 'next step'. After my recent scary moment I think also I'd feel slightly alarmed if a male client told me he wanted to remove all underwear. If he just did it I'd be ok but if he made an issue I'd be worried. I would be fine about it if I worked in a spa with 60 other therapists within shouting distance but I think each therapist goes with what's appropriate for their environment and their client base.
I also notice that primarily it's the guys on this forum who are in favour of naked massage. I reckon that's probably because you don't have all the concerns that we female therapists have.
I do think though that all massage courses should cover the glutes, I mean we even got taught how to massage ears! Yet glutes are main muscle groups - ridiculous!! At least if we were all trained we could incorporate where appropriate.
xx
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
Sally - you echo my thoughts on this precisely.. working from home and sometimes being alone - when you have a new male client you want to feel above all else that you are as totallySAFE AND CLEAR about the therapy which you are offering AND what you are not offering. I think you're doing the right thing.
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
There must be a lot of female therapists out there who do offer extras otherwise why would men ask?
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
I agree Louise.. and hence caution at all times, making sure the client knows what to expect and what not to ask for! Equally importantly- for the peace of mind of the clients we treat on a day to day basis so they know that we are indeed pros - professionals not prostitutes!
I have to say though it's surprised me how many men flick through the Yellow Pages randomly calling therapists with a hope for more. I felt a bit insulted the first time that someone would think that of me, but they must surely get some successes or they'd not bother to ring around again. Just thought how sexist that sounds, but haven't had a woman call for anything dodgy.
It's just a fact really that you can't work as high up a mans leg to free up a tense muscle as you can a woman.. and maintain full decency. You just work around it and use other techniques which wont be deemed intimate by the client - based on their reactions / comfort levels / training / competency and confidence. I think explaining a treatment adequately is paramount - I know that in Ishta Spinal Touch the hooking can seem very intimate indeed and I personally would not massage that far up the leg - it's not appropriate or necessary for the therapies I practice - but for that one in particular the client needs to be aware - imagine their shock if you just went for it and didn't say I'm going to hook here - they might get very worried.
Just returning to the point about training - when I was taught not to massage mens stomachs -
Training varies so much - as another example..I was taught to perform aromatherapy massages from both sidesof the couch- I know others are taught not to, but I think of the potential damage that could be caused by leaning always in the same direction.. those who were taught one side only will feel the treatment will never be broken and that it's the right thing to do. Noone is really right or wrong.. we go with instinct and what training has provided. Remember one thing we're always taught - NEVER do anything you are not adequately trained to do - for those taught not to perform your treatments in a certain way, you're doing the right thing if you haven't been shown how - don't do it.
I do take on board everyones point of view - the most important thing is the treatment itself, that the client walks out feeling they have had the treatment they came for, that they have benefitted physically and mentally, and that both parties are confident that the treatment was carried out appropriately and professionally.
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
I agree with Gussie that it is important to clarify what the treatment involves in the initial consultation with a new client, before the massage begins. In my experience, most of my new clients have a specific reason for making an appointment, eg shoulder pain or lower back pain. I explain what my normal sequence involves, ask if there is anything they would like omitted (usually this is the glutes and/or the abdominals) and if there is any area where they would like particular attention. I have the impression that where some of our newly-qualified therapists may be going wrong is that they are trying to apply a standard ‘one-size-fits-all’ routine to all clients, regardless of the client's needs. A client who has booked an appointment because of tight shoulders will want extra time on that area, and will probably neither want nor need gluteal massage. Conversely, a client who has booked an appointment because of lower back pain will probably benefit from gluteal massage.
On the ‘Yellow Pages’ issue, I personally wouldn’t recommend anyone to advertise in ‘Yellow Pages’, because anyone who does so will almost certainly receive calls from people requiring sexual services. But I’ve already posted my views on this issue in more detail in the separate thread ‘attracting new clients’, where I thought they would get a wider readership (although apparently I was wrong: I’ve only had one reply so far !!).
Alan
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
As a new therapist starting out one of my first clients who came to my home treatment room was a tall man in his fifties.
In my course I was not taught to work the glutes, and told on no account to masssage naked. This seemed a little extreme to me as I have no body hangups myself, and in the course of treating friends and family have always ignored this.
He came for the massage and during the consultation showed himself to be a throughly unpleasant bloke - not willing to answer my questions properly, and a very rude. When I asked him to undress down to his underwear he ignored me and took his underpants off. I asked him to put them back on and he refused and suggested that I was a prude, refused to put them back on and said that any therapist worth their salt would treat naked etc, in general quite intimidating!
I didnt treat him, and asked him to leave, not because he had taken his pants off, but because he couldnt respect that as a female in a home environment with nobody to call for assistance I need to feel safe with my client before I would ask them to undress fully.
In a spa, with many other people on hand to call on I would have happily treated naked. Since then I have refused all male clients for fear of this happening again (loosing plenty of business sadly) and I think people working in spas or clinics with the luxury of backup if things go wrong etc should try to understand the safety situation of therapists working from home. Since I was such an inexperienced therapist at the time I could have been bullied into doing something I was uncomfortable about. Thank god I was confident enough to speak up for myself!
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
Suebee - I'm not sure if your post was intended as a specific reply to my last post, or was a general comment on the whole thread (in which case I think it would probably have been more appropriate on the earlier 'naked massage' thread). I certainly agree that therapists working from home need to be very aware of their personal safety, and I hope that you have read my post on this point in the 'attracting new clients' thread (post no 14 on that thread).
The original query was posted by Deb, who apparently works in a salon (she refers to renting a room), and in such cases I think that therapists need to be able to offer gluteal massage if the client needs it. But as far as working at home is concerned, I think that once a therapist has let a 'dodgy' client into their house, they are in a vulnerable position regardless of their massage routine or their 'house rules' on nudity v underwear.
I certainly think that there is a need for advice for new therapists on avoiding/handling 'dodgy' clients. But I think that it would be more appropriate to continue such a discussion on the 'attracting new clients' thread (where there has already been quite a lively debate), rather than on this particular thread.
Alan
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
I'm a male patient who has had several hour massages. Some therapists I guess are taught to massage the glutes, and some are not, and simply do stretching. In my honest opinion, massaging the glutes, at least for me, had a ton more benefit. The stretching actually a couple times messed up my lower back more. I'm too embarrassed to ask a therapist to work on the glutes, but no doubt it helps.
RE: Swedish Massage and buttocks!
About abdominal massage. I've had some hour massages where therapists did do it, and others where they did not. (All female therapists). I never asked for it to be done, but I do suffer from IBS and chronic stomach problems, which perhaps left the two therapists wanting to massage my stomach because of my client intake form. At parts, it felt really good, but I did feel twinges of pain...probably a good thing, aiding my digestive system. (Not trying to stir up things here, just telling the truth) I will admit, on one of the two occasions I did get accidentally aroused. I was wearing underwear, but not sure if that made it worse or better, really. I guess thetherapist went fairly low on my stomach, since the pain was pretty much all over. The situation to me was a little embarrassing, but I just did the best thing and ignored it as a patient, realizing it is a natural reaction to rubbing the stomach in certain spots. I have to realize that therapists are like doctors - they've seen all sorts of bodies, etc....I think the best thing to do is try to relax and make the best of the situation and enjoy the rest of the massage. I hada sheetcovering near the line of my underwear, but the therapist would be blind not to have noticed something I would think. I didn't look. Obviously, even if guys are aroused it doesn't mean they are having sexual thoughts or they are untrustworthy...it just happens. I am one of the most safe, non-threatening male clients there is, and it happened to me! So, no big deal.
Use of chart to specify areas to be treated
Can somebody please assist? Some time ago in a discussion concerning disrobing a respondent gave a web address for a diagram that was presented to clients and they were to 'red circle' areas not to be massages and to 'green tick' areas they wished to be treated.
I'd like to revisit that thread - my experience has been based on assuring the client that I will only treat areas that they are wholly comfortable with me treating - in addition to advising on use of towels to assure them that modesty will not be conpromised.
Many thanks
Anxious
RE: Use of chart to specify areas to be treated
Hi Anxious. I agree with you entirely. I was taught on my VTCT course to massage all over. I now always give the client the opportunity to say no to certain areas - I do explain how much more beneficial it would be, but I always give them the final choice. If they feel uncomfortable, they won't come back no matter how "good for them" it would be. If everthing is explained from the outset then there is less confusion and embarrassment. They are the paying client - it should be their choice.
Lower back problems almost exclusively stem from three areas. Tightness in hips and glutes, tightness in hamstrings, and weak abdominals. So an important aspect of a sweedish is hitting all these areas.
Hi there
When I did my training at college the tutor did mention that normally the buttocks are included in swedish massage. I think she may have done 1 demo right at the beginning of the course, but said we wouldn't be covering it on the course due to privacy of each student.
So i've tended to avoid that area when doing a massage, so I'm wondering whether I should be doing it, as I see quite a few of you seem to. If so, does that mean that clients should have no underwear on?
The tutor also said we should ask male clients to wear shorts and not go up too high on the thigh area. This would make buttock work quite difficult.
Another question related to this as well, do you ask the client if they want an abdominal massge at consultation, or do you automatically include it, or avoid it? Just curious on this one.
Regards
Deb
Glutes are one of key muscles. If you not cover them, massages is useless