Heavenly dance

RE: Heavenly dance

Dear Cub

Yes all is open to interpretation and depend on the judgement of the society of the day! How the joy of dance could ever be perceived as destructive beats me. However, I am sure that you will explain further so that we may appreciate the understanding of this philosophy.

I did post a short article here on the 'Cosmic Dance' that included mention of this paper that I found interesting, I would welcome your view and comments thereof.

‘Radha in the Erotic Play of the Universe’ paper by David Scott

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Just saw this thread, and I already posted on the one it comes from.

I never thought of Shiva naked as being sexual... Shivites who emulate him (a form of yogi) live naked even in the towns. It's actually for them a renunciation that the body has any meaning, so why clothe it?

On dance and destruction, Kim, think of replacing "destruction" with "ending". Just as life has birth, life, and death - which isn't necessarily a bad thing. Or even forget death. A better example would be that a carpenter builds a chair (birth), people use it for years (life) but the time comes when everything is decrepid and is best put into the fire or remade into something else. So Shiva partly represents that god and needed end of things. He "dances" on the "bodies" and crushes people under him. Hindu symbolism needs some understanding and isn't literal! :D- like Hanuman the monkey god or an elephant God, etc., etc.

V

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: venetian

Hindu symbolism needs some understanding and isn't literal! 😀 - like Hanuman the monkey god or an elephant God, etc., etc.

V

Dear David

Thank you for the further explanation I do understand where you are coming from. I am looking at this from a very different perspective outside of the literals and how Hindu and other religious symbolism was interpreted. As interpretation usually comes from the perceptional consciousness, attitudes, prejudices etc of the day e.g. the Wrathful God came out of the Aeon of Aries the Ram. A wrathful consciousness created a wrathful GOD possibility!

Your analogy was a good one about the chair. However the soul is not dense like a chair, 😉 the soul and its consciousness is more like a flower that grows into the fullness of GOD's perfection. Being that there is no death and that we are immortal just like the flower it re-creates itself through re-seeding. The flower does not need destruction or anyone to dance upon it to kill it anymore than humanity needs destruction when we live by the universal natural laws. So was this philosophy of destruction coming from man's own consciousness?

The words reincarnation could be recreation. Creation being on-going with no ending and no beginning.

Is it not man's attachment to the physical realm that creates consciousness of destruction and endings? When life and consciousness is ever evolving or descending depending on whether man is fallen or corrupted.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

PS

Is not also the belief (religious or otherwise) in destruction that helps to create it e.g the biology of belief and if people only believed in perfection they would create it mind, body and soul?

The heavenly state of being!

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

This is the Hinduism sub-forum. Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva (Creation, Preservation, Destruction) are foundational to Hinduism - among the basics. I wouldn't expect to debate that on the Hinduism sub-forum itself.

Things come and go, in the physical world that is. In Hinduism even the Universe itself has cycles (pralayas) of appearing (being born), existing, and then disappearing into a mysterious nothingness (physically).

It's really very simple. A part of Shiva's symbolism is the 'disappearance' stage. Matter/energy is taken away from objects, even human bodies, so that there can be a renewal in the new Creation.

I don't think you've understood, as I already tried to say, that it's not 'destruction' in a negative sense - it's change. For example, tree eventually dies but becomes compost for renewal. The human negative aspect of the ego 'dies' and who would not want that? Shiva represents all of this.

V xxx

RE: Heavenly dance

Dear cub and everyone

Although not born a Hindu this time around, I have absorbed many of the beliefs and traditions of Hinduism during my time in India and I wanted to put this point of view: I have always been taught that Siva Nataraj (Shiva Lord of the Dance) is keeping the cosmos in motion with his dance. That if he stops, so will life, the universe and everything. This is certainly the way Nataraj is seen in Tamil Nadu. And as Lord Shiva dances he tramples underfoot the dwarf of ignorance (ego).

Om namah Sivaya.

Much love
Sunanda xxx

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: venetian

This is the Hinduism sub-forum. Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva (Creation, Preservation, Destruction) are foundational to Hinduism - among the basics. I wouldn't expect to debate that on the Hinduism sub-forum itself.

V xxx

I appreciate that David but my fundamental question is this 'Is everything cast in stone? CF'S say exactly the same as you when one questions the viability of their doctrines of sin, hell and damnation and the basics as they view it that one can only be saved by Jesus Christ.

Do peoples understandings, perceptions and consciousness not change and in doing so their whole view of scripture being seen with new eyes?

The rug is certainly being pulled from under the feet of Christianity and Judiasm by their own are there any signs of this in Hinduism?

Many thanks for your contributions to these questions, I promise you they are sincere.

There was a time when you accused me of not questioning anything yet I question everything and always have.

Dear Sunanda

Thank you for your sharing that is the way I understood it too but you express it much better than I.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: Sacredstar

The rug is certainly being pulled from under the feet of Christianity and Judiasm by their own are there any signs of this in Hinduism?

An interesting question. Over the last 100 years I'd say it's been the other way around. "Hinduism" didn't exist as a discrete religion until, well - 150 years ago. It's a word the nglish applied to almost all beliefs and practices they found in India. 150 years ago, Indians didn't use the word or think of themselves as Hindu. They were a large varietyof things Shaivites, yogis, worshippers of Krishna. To present a united front they adapted the term "Hindu" for themselves only in the late 1800s. So in a way it's in reverse - "Hinduism" in a sense is very new, not old and changing through age.

It's actually not one religion unlike the others, but many,so one can't make sweeping statements that it's changing this way or that.

Venetian xxx

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: venetian

So in a way it's in reverse - "Hinduism" in a sense is very new, not old and changing through age. It's actually not one religion unlike the others, but many, so one can't make sweeping statements that it's changing this way or that.

Venetian xxx

Thank you. So how and what could one align it with? Do you think it is more appropriate to the future and if there is a religion at all be it one of 'personal experience' or just 'experience' itself? Individuals being totally true to self and not an 'authority' type organisation like the old religions.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Dear Sunanda

Interesting that Hinduism and Buddhism embrace this word 'ignorance' when in modern day the supreme love of GOD asks us to 'replace the word ignorance with innocence.'

This is just one example of the difference of the old beliefs that keep people in separation and the new unity consciousness that many are now participating in. I include you in the unity and appreciate that you are sharing literal beliefs from a different culture and state of being. 😉

I love comparative religion but I also love the positivity of what GOD shows us now.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Hi Kim,

Well if you recall that thread with the test - "Which religion are you?" - I scored 97% Hinduism. ;)So I'd see it personally as containing more in it for the future than the authoritarian religions ("Believe this book and this preacher or else".) But it also has its aspects of some superstition. All the present religions seem to.

But take karma and reincarnation - IMHO any religion not including these has no place in the future... They give a rational basis for morality and explain a lot.

Venetian

RE: Heavenly dance

Dear Kim

You said:

Interesting that Hinduism and Buddhism embrace this word 'ignorance' when in modern day the supreme love of GOD asks us to 'replace the word ignorance with innocence.'

but I think we have to accept that 'ignorance' is just a word with many definitions. In this case I've always taken it in the context of 'not knowing who we truly are' ie that we are God. I think it's a reference to the fact that people believe that they are separate and are ignorant of the fact that they (we) are not.

Love
Sunanda xxx

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: venetian

Hi Kim,

Well if you recall that thread with the test - "Which religion are you?" - I scored 97% Hinduism. 😉 So I'd see it personally as containing more in it for the future than the authoritarian religions ("Believe this book and this preacher or else".) But it also has its aspects of some superstition. All the present religions seem to.

But take karma and reincarnation - IMHO any religion not including these has no place in the future... They give a rational basis for morality and explain a lot.

Venetian

I scored the same earlier in the year 😀 LOL!

Yes I agree in fact scholars tell me that Christianity did include this before it was removed from the first two bibles of Marcion and Origen. That's why I like the Jesus Sutra's they are more true to the original.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: sunanda

"but I think we have to accept that 'ignorance' is just a word with many definitions. In this case I've always taken it in the context of 'not knowing who we truly are' ie that we are God.  I think it's a reference to the fact that people believe that they are separate and are ignorant of the fact that they (we) are not. Love Sunanda xxx

Yes I appreciate that. However, it is very apparent that it is GOD's will for us to understand and appreciate the impact certain words have on our biology shown to us by Professor Bruce Lipton, Dr Emoto etc. Maybe our consciousness is at the level to be able to understand the science of words and their impact now in our 21st century consciousness. I feel that this is something that Jesus also tried to teach us with 'no judgement' and 'the measure you give will be the measure you receive'.

We have the choice to select positive, negative or neutral words IMHE. We can replace fear with love and ignorance with innocence. As Jesus said 'the last will be first and the first will be last to enter the Kingdom of Heaven' To have the innocence of a child is the way through the eye of the needle.

Does GOD mind if people are innocent? I feel not. 😉 As long as we are happy! Hence why the Gospel of Thomas concentrates on Happiness.

Is there an equivalent scripture on Happiness in Hinduism?

Love beyond measure

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Back to the heavenly dance I came across this other day when doing some research on Cortesans. David and Cub were talking about music not to sure whether it was this or another thread but this seems to fit in here.

Living legends of entertainment that did it in style outside of the temples

The music of the baijis has been around in India since recorded history.

They are mentioned in ancient texts and there are exquisite Mughal paintings of women entertainers. However the tradition which had lasted centuries was all but eradicated with the advent of the British.

Some baijis remained legends well into their autumn years - alluring their audiences with solely by their musical prowess. The early photos of Gauhar Jan for example show a fairly average looking woman, with not a hint of the unearthly beauty of the goddesses of the Bollywood screen, but at her peak, Gauhar Jan was the "princess of Calcutta" according to Professor Joep Bor, from the Rotterdam Conservatory of Music.

Lalita du Perron from the University of London specialises in the music and poetry of the baijis. "The British took over the courts and curtailed their power and finance…the courts began to disappear as the 20th century came on and that really got rid of courtesan life." And the growing independence movement of the late 19th and early 20th century didn't help, she adds. "People wanted to emulate a western model and so women singing, dancing, using their bodies in a sexual transaction became unacceptable."

So music can die out and sometimes be reborn again if and when rediscovered, just like scripture and the ancient mystery teachings.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Of course the heavenly dance is enjoyed by others in other religions.

The Sufi's being some of them. I love this quote from Rumi, the mystic and wonderful poet.

"I don't dance to find God, I dance because I've found God!"

being love

Kim x

RE: Heavenly dance

There was a 60-minute documentary rather late two nights ago on Sufi dancing. I taped it as I couldn't see it then, and it's so good I may not wipe it. The presenter, as I recall a Hindu who has developed an interest in Islam through Sufism, went from one country to another, showing how styles of Sufi - actually it was more about music than dance, but dance too - differ enormously, but with the same basic precepts. A superb programme, I thought. They did give a link for more info somewhere at [link= http://www.bbc.co.uk ]www.bbc.co.uk[/link] and then somewhere on that.

Two things really came across:

1. All the Sufis in different countries said, "This is not dance; this is ritual."

(As an aside, the whirling dervishes - and they said Rumi was one - I always wondered "Don't they get very dizzy?" It was said that it's all done, as you could see, in deep prayer, and you do get dizzy for about two months - then the brain adjusts. Actually they whirl fairly slowly. It looks like just one of a million ways of focussing the mind to me.)

2. Most important of all, what came across almost as the theme of the programme, is that there are millions of Sufis in all the Islamic nations (though they are banned and work underground in Turkey which tries to be non-Islamic), and they are the very, total opposite of Islamic fundamentalism. It's basically a war being waged for hearts within Islam. The fundies, who are behind the violence, proclaim music and dance as sinful. By utter contrast, Sufis all see music as a uniting force and a great way to God. But they are so moderate and open that people of all other religions join them. In fact a week-long (I think) festival is held in Morocco each year featuring Sufi music from around the world. All sorts of people were there and I found the idea caught me too....

Sufism and its music - which is "popular" music even in some places - may be the ultimate answer in overcoming Islamic fundamentalism.

V

RE: Heavenly dance

David

Please have a look at this thread and tell me if you think it was the same programme:

If so, the presenter was not a Hindu but William Dalrymple who has lived in India for years and writes the most superb travel books I've ever read.

I think it must be the same film from what you say of it. Believe me, it was great to see it on a bigger screen. I thought it was a wonderful programme and we got to hear some of the performers live. I am really attracted to Sufism and feel that one of my 'projects' this winter may be to learn more about it. When I discovered the poetry of Hafiz, I learned that Sufism was often attacked by Islamic fundamentalists right from the earliest times. Hence a lot of their poetic vocabulary is symbolic: 'the beloved' refers to God not to an earthly romantic attachment. In the film I watched they made the point that Sufi music is now crossing over into the mainstream of 'clubbing' because it is, after all, the original trance music. I have read elsewhere that we humans have always sought heightened awareness through trance - on another thread i mentioned the drumming which accompanies the piercing of Hindu followers of Lord Murugan. Trance music is fascinating....

Anyway, do let me know if you're referring to the same programme.

Love
Sunanda xxxx

RE: Heavenly dance

Sunanda, hi,

Without looking at your link, I recognise the guy's name. Yes, the same programme. "Bigger screen"? Does this mean you saw it on cinema or something?

It was an eye-opener for me as I had the impression that Sufis were a kind of secret minority (as per the impression gained from books such as Idries Shah). Here they were a major bloc within Islam and fairly out in the open, or at least when performing in public. How opposite to Islamic fundamentalism can you get? The problem being though that it is so different as to be virtually a different religion, and perhaps unrecognisable as Islam to those brought up in a traditonal or hard-line way - I don't know. The annual "Fest" in Fez attracted me!

Yes, as an aside comment it was made perfectly clear that all the references such as in Rumi's poetry is symbolic, and they even quoted him as saying or writing "When I write of wine I'm talking about communion with God" - to settle that old thread which I recall. I'd also thought the dervishes (whirling) was more a kind of 'abandonment' but it is actually so wonderfully controlled and graceful. Since it has "four movements" like a symphony I don't know if I would call it trance so much as controlled meditation.

So re the thread, "Heavenly Dance", I like their definition that "It is not dance, but ritual". And to repeat myself, this could be the solution to the fundy problem in Islam - but then where were / are the Sufis when things are going on such as the Taliban, the current governance of Iran, and the state of Iraq? Perhaps they don't get so involved in worldly politics? Or they keep out of sight?

V

RE: Heavenly dance

The fundies, who are behind the violence, proclaim music and dance as sinful.

The same in early Christianity.

The Sufi's are very much like the Jain's in their belief in non-violence, they are very much in the heart of love. I found a wonderful article yesterday and a Sufi's comments on Guru's which resonated with my own heart of love. I will post a link.

I learned that Sufism was often attacked by Islamic fundamentalists right from the earliest times. Hence a lot of their poetic vocabulary is symbolic: 'the beloved' refers to God not to an earthly romantic attachment.

Yes it is written that they are Gnostics just like the early Christian Gnostics that were also called heretics. Yes, the lover and the beloved and the sacred union with the divine. However, it is also easy to forget that GOD loves through man hence why the sacred physical temple is so important. I can recommend a lovely book called 'The Way of Love' which is a story based upon the life of Rumi.

PS Here is one of Alexius comments on my thread about Sufism.

"Defining Sufism: here is one definition. There is a hadith (the Jibrail Hadith) that has the religion consist of three elements: 'Islam' (acceptence of God's will), 'Iman' (faith) and 'Ihsan'. Ihsan is defined as acting as if you can see God, as God can certainly see you. It is said that the aim of Sufism is to attain perfect Ihsan - a constant awareness of God's presense in one's life, and confirmation of the articles of Faith through personal experience. In which case Sufism is Gnostic, rather than Existential."

So the term Gnostic comes up again GOD being the living experience, hand in hand, side by side. In many ways the Sufi mystics are like mystics of any other tradition that promotes that the oneness with GOD is found in the heart.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Here is a wonderful article on the Sufi Tradition.

He talks about those seeking Guru's coming from need, why Sufi's are not interested in becoming Guru's and the mystical experience.

"In responsible Sufi circles, no one attempts to handle either the sneerers or the worshippers, and they are very politely detached from the others. They are not fertile ground? They have something else to do first. And what they need is offered abundantly elsewhere."

"Hall: Many of the great Sufi teachers seem to regard the ecstatic experience as only a way station.

People get stuck at the way stations due to attachment in my experience

Shah: Oh, yes. The ecstatic experience is absolutely the lowest from of advanced knowledge. Western biographers of the saints have made it very difficult for us by assuming that Joan of Arc and Theresa of Avila, who have had such experiences, have reached God. I am sure that this is only a misunderstanding based on faulty stories and faulty retrieval of information.

(It sounds like he has not had such a religious experience)

Hall: Sufis also seem to take extra-sensory perception as a matter of course and as not very interesting.

Shah: Not interesting at all. It is no more than a by-product. Let me give you a banal analogy. If I were training to be a runner and went out every day to run, I would get faster and faster and be able to run farther and farther with less fatigue. Now, I also find that I have a better complexion, my blood supply is better, and my digestion has improved. These things don't interest me; they are only by-products of my running. I have another objective. When people I am associated with become overwhelmed by ESP phenomena, I always insist that they stop it, because their objective is elsewhere.

I agree with him there, although I view ESP as a very different kettle of fish to the oneness with GOD

Hall: They are supposed to be developing their potential; not attempting to read minds or move objects around.

I think we would all agree with that

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: Sacredstar

Hall: Sufis also seem to take extra-sensory perception as a matter of course and as not very interesting.

Shah: Not interesting at all. It is no more than a by-product. Let me give you a banal analogy. If I were training to be a runner and went out every day to run, I would get faster and faster and be able to run farther and farther with less fatigue. Now, I also find that I have a better complexion, my blood supply is better, and my digestion has improved. These things don't interest me; they are only by-products of my running. I have another objective. When people I am associated with become overwhelmed by ESP phenomena, I always insist that they stop it, because their objective is elsewhere.

He means everything from channelling to mediumship, which is surely enough to make one stop and think. These are 'psychic' or 'ESP' phenomena in his opinion, and not a part of the Path to God. Read more Shah and you'll see I am not taking him out of context - this is what he is saying.

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: Sacredstar

I learned that Sufism was often attacked by Islamic fundamentalists right from the earliest times. Hence a lot of their poetic vocabulary is symbolic: 'the beloved' refers to God not to an earthly romantic attachment.

Yes it is written that they are Gnostics just like the early Christian Gnostics that were also called heretics. Yes, the lover and the beloved and the sacred union with the divine. However, it is also easy to forget that GOD loves through man hence why the sacred physical temple is so important.

You don't seem willing to 'get' it and never have. The living Sufis in all the nations covered in that programme say that the wording is totally symbolic. What people then do in their physical lives is up to them, and I don't at all suggest that Sufis are all ascetics. Most marry, etc. But the vocabulary of Rumi is stated by the Sufis themselves, and even by Rumi, to becompletely symbolic.

Sufis don't particularly feel that the body is "so important" - that's just your personal 'take' on thread after thread.

RE: Heavenly dance

As Shah says it is a by product David a way station. For instance I was taken through the stages of mediumship on my way home to GOD and when GOD showed me it was time to move on from this professional mediumship I did so. In the last year I was told that it is time to move onwards and upwards from the Ascended Masters and just be in total oneness with GOD.

I am fortunate to be able to detach from different phases of development and evolvement when it is GOD's will for me to do so. Are you?

On Ritual

Sufism is not, as often stated by westerners, a sect of Islam. It is, rather, a dimension found in and compatible with all manifestations of Islam, whether Sunni or Shiite, no matter what the Muslims are, intelligentsia or peasant, urban or rural. . . .

In summary, faithful  Muslims who are not Sufis obey God and believe that God is merciful and will reward them according to their righteous deeds. The goal is to enjoy life in this world and prepare for the world to come. They diligently perform the five pillars and this aids them in "remembering Allah." However, their self-renunciation and abstinence do not go beyond their expected duties and obligations.

Sufis, on the other hand, passionately yearn for God. Their remembrance is total, a struggle (jihad) to be united with Divine Love. The Sufi's goal is not to perform certain rituals and hope thereby to become closer to God; the goal is to be united to God without any mediation whatsoever.

A Sufi does not neglect action but sees action as a completion. There is a sense in which Sufis see themselves as "fulfilled Muslims."

Ira G. Zepp Jr., A Muslim Primer,  University of Arkansas Press, 2000, p. 115-20

Love beyond measure

Kim xx
 

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: venetian

ORIGINAL: Sacredstar

I learned that Sufism was often attacked by Islamic fundamentalists right from the earliest times. Hence a lot of their poetic vocabulary is symbolic: 'the beloved' refers to God not to an earthly romantic attachment.

Yes it is written that they are Gnostics just like the early Christian Gnostics that were also called heretics. Yes, the lover and the beloved and the sacred union with the divine. However, it is also easy to forget that GOD loves through man hence why the sacred physical temple is so important.

You don't seem willing to 'get' it and never have. The living Sufis in all the nations covered in that programme say that the wording is totally symbolic. What people then do in their physical lives is up to them, and I don't at all suggest that Sufis are all ascetics. Most marry, etc. But the vocabulary of Rumi is stated by the Sufis themselves, and even by Rumi, to be completely symbolic.

Sufis don't particularly feel that the body is "so important" - that's just your personal 'take' on thread after thread.

Oh yes I do get it David and I understand the philosophy and experience well in the same way as you understand it. The only difference is that I live it.

However, I also get what some have missed and what GOD has taught me - that GOD is everywhere.

I unite with the Sufi's on total surrender and with the Buddhists on zero attachment to physical (or any other) reality.

Through this we can become Divine Love in manifestation on the earth plane united with GOD.

PS To put it in another context as explained in the bible you can get to the state of being when 'we become the Christ', the lover and the beloved become one, true oneness with the source. As Jesus says in the Gospel of Thomas and other scripture 'the two become one'.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

PS

Also David if you read the life story of Rumi you will discover that many of the poems that he wrote to the beloved were for his spiritual teacher who was a man, it was not until he lost his spiritual teacher that he went into total dispair and was forced to surrender. After this he then made his breakthroughs with divine love and his understanding of the true relationship with GOD.

He wrote this when his spiritual teacher died.

"Who dares say the immortal one has died?
Who dares say that the sun of hope has set?
An enemy of the sun has climbed onto the roof
Closed his eyes and declared the sun has set."

After he came to terms with his loss and detachment, he discovered that at whatever door he knocked, in whatever strange town, he would find God there, for the door was that of his own heart and GOD lived within.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Heavenly dance

Honestly, Kim and David, I do wish you two would stop squabbling. It does you no credit.

Love
Sunanda xxx

RE: Heavenly dance

Sunanda beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder !

And as David so rightly says 'behold we are the temple of the living God' 😉

I have learnt that God does indeed work in mysterious ways and as long as we walk in joy and a smile on our face all is well. 😀

We are often advised not to take things so seriously and I think that is very good advice. 😉

Love beyond measure

Kim xx

PS some do not look for credit or praise

RE: Heavenly dance

ORIGINAL: venetian
it's not 'destruction' in a negative sense - it's change.

I agree, David. It's moving energy on to a new and higher level. Even in our every day lives we shed skin cells, parts of our thinking, old emotions etc that are no longer relevant to our growth and sense of being. We literally are changing in order to allow room for the new. For me Lord Shiva's dance fits in with the endless tide of birth, demise and renewal - it's a spinning wheel of endless change.

Spot on, Sunanda, about the description of the dance of Nataraj! This dance is called Tandava. Lord Shiva is traditionally depicted as dancing in a crematorium covered in ashes, grieving over the loss of his first wife, Sati.

However, there's another type of less well known dance that Lord Shiva/Nataraj engaged in called Lasaya. This is very different. This is a dance of peace and beatitude, of creation and caress. He dances with his wife, Parvati, and together they form a new divinity which is half male and half female: Ardha-nareeshwara.

I love the juxtaposition of these two dances. One is of death (leading to a clearing of space for the new), and the other is of hope and renewal.

Whilst in our human lives some seek to attain enlightenment by overcoming the rebirth cycle, here we have deities who provide comfort in their movements that life and death are a natural part of the human experience. It makes living life on earth bearable to have gods dancing to the rhythm of our wordly experiences.

I think this is one of the reasons that my faith provides me with comfort about the idea of experiencing death. It's not something that I am fearful about.

Cub