Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

How about a new thread. "Bird Flu - Fuel the Fear".

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

A lot was going on in 1917 but little was positive apart from Fatima (which I've visited). World War One, thehuman population getting culled by bird flu, and what Fatima warned was imminent: the Russian Revolution leading to Lenin, and later even worse, Stalin getting into power. Not a great time to be around for many people.

On mystical or esoteric ways of dealing with bird flu, such as gematria, 'not thinking about it' and so on, that's really interesting. Apparently all kinds of wierd and wonderful 'miracle cures' were tried and 1917-18 became a time of great irrationality. People wore camphor around their necks and stunk every place out, though it did no good, everyone wore cloth masks though these did nothing either, and there were charms, lucky amulets, you name it. So it brought out the irrational.

What's really interesting is that it was a huge event in modernhuman history, but for one reason or another it was 'forgotten'. Nobody wanted to think about it or remember back to it, so in our generations we didn't even know of it until it recently came out again.

Sharon, as I said in my first post, I see no point in fear. Said the same in a previous thread on this. It may well not happen at all. If it does, fear doesn't help a jot. So it's just a question of discussing a massively important potential occurrence. In fact, I'd say it's a symptom of fear to want to look away and pretend! [&:]

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Yes Venetian, you may say what you wish, as may I:)

You may see my views as conspiracy theory, I clearly don't.

Cest la vie

As it is I don't believe in this Bird Flu any more than I believe in pink spotted flying elephants in ballet attire!

Governments can provide "proof" of anything they like. That doesn't mean we have to believe it.

Donna

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Hi Donna.

That's the actual reason why I went into the fact that it happens on average every several decades. That's historical fact. If it's happened many times before, why would it be a 'trick' now? - is my point. While it hasn't mutated into human-transmissable form, it's killed quite a few (over a hundred) already. So some trick.

I do know conspiracies or government tricks can occur, and didn't mean to upset you or whatever. But this is global, every nation accepting it, and the UN very active. The idea that the present bird flu isn't real, or that it can't mutate, really can't be taken seriously.

Try a search on the 1917 pandemic and read the percentages per nation of fatalities. Many people are still alive to talk about it, in every nation, recounting how a third or a half of their town went down.

It's good to look these things straight on in order to make preparations in the emergency services, should it be required - and let's hope not.

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Oh, rude words - I'd just written a long erudite etc etc post and it disappeared - so briefly.
1)Basically I agree with you David - not only that but I've been forearmed with an amulet - a homoeopathic potion sent me by my homoeopathic sister(if anyone is interested in this let me know.). I have enough to save my road apparently. It's a shame it's too late for the lady two doors away who died last week. She kept a budgie.
2) I grew up with a paranoid schizophrenic as my Mum, and I'm up to here with conspiracy theories. Some of the writing on HP sounds like her talking. Bless her. And bless anyone out there with the same affliction.
3)I don't understand why you think there is an international conspiracy to ground birds. Or to invent a disease? Maybe I'm a bit tired and possibly stupid, but I don't see the point.
4)Millions of people die every year of malaria and Aids and there's ne'er a peep. Compare and contrast the frenzy.
5) A government scientist on Today R4 a few weeks ago said he couldn't see what the fuss was about. When John Humphries said that it was because of the cross-species aspect, he said why not get worked up about bovine TB then and talk about badgers.

So badgers to you all.

Edited for grammar and to bless all schizophrenics

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

It may well not happen this time around, so we can all smile about it then in 18-24 months. 😉

One disturbing thing is that in 1917-18 it was mainly children and young, fit adults in their 20s who succombed. Some experts think that's because a degree of immunity carries over from one bird-flu pandemic to another. In 1917, those older than 30-odd had already been through a previous one of the late 1800s. This time, unless we were born by 1917 (!) no-one has natural immunity.

I was thinking this situation through while out tonight, and if it happens regularly when generations lose immunity the only solution - and there is a solution - is a very long-term one. It almost always begins in those appalling conditions of the south-eastern markets (no, not East of Pall Mall!), and also the way people live among chickens there, and the way they are killed. Boy, even all those SE governments can't stop that, as they have little control over how people live.

One day, one day, that way of life has to be cleaned up. I mean, some of us are veggies so what use have we for all those chickens anyway? [&:]

Venetian

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

3)I don't understand  why you think there is an international conspiracy to ground birds. Or to invent a disease? Maybe I'm a bit tired and possibly stupid, but I don't see the point.

I am not surprised Sharon because you missed the inner meanings, its not so much about grounding birds but grounding humans, so you might like to try again, read the information very slowly, digest slowly without gut reaction, sit quietly, ponder on the words, then a light might turn on for you. You are certanly not stupid but you are looking at it with a literal eye and not a spiritual eye. Try tuning in intuitively.

We now know from new science and new biology that our thoughts and belief can create disease. It is the Biology of the Belief, I will leave you to work out the rest.

Thank you David for more information on 1917. What was going on in Theosophy in 1917?

Divine Love

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

It seems that Theosophy was really coming into its own at this time.

1917    An Occult View of the War.   Los Angeles, Calif. ; Theosophical Publishing House.  23 pp.   Online Edition.  Another Online Ed   Another Online Ed.

1917    Starlight:  Seven Addresses Given for Love of the Star.   Adyar, Madras, India, Theosophical Publishing House.  104 pp.

1917    The Coming of the World-Teacher and Death, War and Evolution.   London, George Allen & Unwin.  242 pp.

1917    Ancient Ideals in Modern Masonry:  An Address Given to the Sydney Lodge No. 404, in 1915.  Sydney:  London Craft Lodge of Universal
            Co-Freemasonry.   31 pp.

And was it not during the years leading up to 1917 that Thesophy were talking about the discovery of the New World Teacher e.g. Krishnamurti

Divine Love

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

K was around at that time; the publications are insignificant and the TS was pouring them out every year.

Some friends believe the collapse of the World Teacher project (K running away from it) led to the later WWII and the depression before that. But I've no idea.

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Well when I checked on Theosophy, yes many publications were coming out every year I agree, but I would not say pouring from the evidence on the net. However, this growth in Theosophy that attracted so many academic and good minds from around the world would certainly have been a concern for the powers that be. The powers that be do not worry about what they consider to be minions but when the academics go for it that is a different matter altogether. We are witnessing the same now, eventhough the US is trying to suppress new science etc. The Academics are getting very much involved and with some it is leading their scientific intent and discoveries.

As far as running away is concerned, one cannot blame a soul for living their own truth, following their own heart of conscience and listening to God. He knew that he was not the New World Teacher although others may have desired him to be so for their own ends, I applaud him for living in integrity and standing up for the truth when he knew how much others would be upset by his choice to be true. One cannot groom someone to be who they are not, nor can one interfere with the divine plan that is pre-destined and appointed by God.

Divine Love

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Off-topic, but you can't say a thing about K without having studied him in much detail, as I haven't either. There are many perspectives. You can hardly applaud him for 'standing up for truth' when he said 'There is no truth'. He didn't 'listen to God': one perspective is that he turned bitter at Fate when his brother died, so renounced anything higher. In a sense he was a bit like our mate Datta.But is complex - you and I would be discussing K with pretty worthless, mereopinions; there's a need to study the history of what happened and the biog of what he became.

Try [link= http://www.alpheus.org ]www.alpheus.org[/link]

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

ORIGINAL: Divine Love

3)I don't understand why you think there is an international conspiracy to ground birds. Or to invent a disease? Maybe I'm a bit tired and possibly stupid, but I don't see the point.

I am not surprised Sharon because you missed the inner meanings, its not so much about grounding birds but grounding humans, so you might like to try again, read the information very slowly, digest slowly without gut reaction, sit quietly, ponder on the words, then a light might turn on for you. You are certanly not stupid but you are looking at it with a literal eye and not a spiritual eye. Try tuning in intuitively.

We now know from new science and new biology that our thoughts and belief can create disease. It is the Biology of the Belief, I will leave you to work out the rest.

Sorry, no lights turned on. The most I've gleaned from this thread is Reikidonna's proposal that there is a conspiracy to use Bird flu to infect those who might protest against a war in Iran, which strikes me as most unlikely. You said (and irritatingly I can't use the quote facility) "If you wanted to stop birds flying what would you do? Create something to keep them grounded." If you mean humans and not birds, why not use human 'flu? And then there was some numerology stuff which didn't appear to have any significance for anyone else but you.
As for digesting slowly without gut reaction - well there's yet another logistical problem within that instruction. I got metaphorical reflux. However I'm unwilling to give up on understanding this thread. So I am asking for an interpreter: someone with the required intuitive eye and flair for logical explanation. V could you possibly help? I'm not worried about the numerology/Theosophy aspect - just a sentence or two on why they think Bird flu is a conspiracy. Just this thread - I won't make a habit of asking for remedial assistance.
Sharon.

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Dear David

I appreciate where you are coming from and understand where K was coming from too. I did read the link of the website when the originator and I had some email dialog a few years ago. However, David I did not study the man in depth because I do not need to. I listen to my heart of God and Theosophy's blame of his brother dying does not resonate with my heart but all are welcome to their beliefs. In truth his statement is true in the context of which it was meant, he knew that the only thing that really mattered was love. When I think of him I feel great love and peace and that is lovely to feel in one's heart of grace.

Dear Sharon

Because I am using spiritual words to talk about something that can impact on the soul. My signature says it all 'teach your soul to fly'. Our soul consciousness is made of many vibrational frequencies and these energies can be impacted upon by other energetic frequencies. In Egypt they call the evolution of consciousness 'The Phoenix Rising from the Ashes' the Phoenix has wings in the same way as angels do, we are the angels.

This is why the rising of Theosopy at the point the last virus appears to have reared its head is interesting in this discussion. And you say all this is only relevant to me well no, it is relevant to anyone and everyone that thinks or writes the name of the virus because the words create the numbers that create the energetic vibrational frequency that can impact on the soul. We also know that a belief in the existence of a disease can create it - that is the biology of the belief proven by science. So the messages here are multi-dimensional for those that have the eyes to see, the ears to hear and the heart to embrace. I shall treat it in the same way that I treated my own cancer, I shall not give it any credibility at all, as far as I am concerned it just does not exist in my domain. I do not give it consent to exist and so I move beyond and above it and you can too. Negative energy can only exist if we give it any credibility, thought and intent is one of the great mysteries of the universe and the original meaning of mystery is 'riddle'.

So although you may not have understood the words written here I know that many other people do, because they understand the terms, the concepts and the reality of what I am writing. If people choose to reject that is fine, at least I have done what I am guided to do and that is to inform those that understand and can take it on board.

Divine Love

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

ORIGINAL: spinal music

V could you possibly help? I'm not worried about the numerology/Theosophy aspect - just a sentence or two on why they think Bird flu is a conspiracy.

Oh, thanks a lot, Sharon! ;)Put me on the spot. I have no idea and was just responding to the idea that bird flu isn't real as in (1) birds die from it; (2) these things can jump species and have before. LOL, I haven't a clue what it has to do with Theosophy either! Why not Taoism or the Fabian Society? I really don't know.

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

That's a good point David I was thinking of the rising of consciousness due to spirituality, if I had more time I would research what was happening in other cultures around the world at the same time. But alas, I am getting behind and really must finish my preparations and packing.

Have fun everyone

Divine Love

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

ORIGINAL: Divine Love

I did not study the man in depth because I do not need to.

Neither did I and my perspective is opposite. In other words, pat answers get us nowhere.

he knew that the only thing that really mattered was love.

Or sex without love as he had quite a few secretive affairs?

When I think of him I feel great love and peace

I don't dislike the man - I never met him! But when I think of him I think of his 'Teachings' and his own late statement that not one person he knew had succeeded in them.

This is why the rising of Theosopy at the point the last virus

There was nothing at all unusual happening in Theosophy at that time more than at any other time. What a wierd connection.

I'm glad diseases we can effectively deal with are dealt with by scientists and real researchers - and that these days we don't leave treatment to numerology!! [:-]

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Sorry V. I appreciate you are probably busy trimming : I just thought if there was anything logical in it you might have got it.

Have a lovely time Kim.

Sharon.

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Oh dear David as positive as ever 😀 Well the words that I have read of his were very positive indeed and God does not judge anyone for Sacred Love only man appears to do that. I have learnt that accusations about others come from peoples own guilty consciences. Well I don't know about going nowhere David I am off to the Holy Land and that is sacred indeed. I do wish you could see the best in everyone and as Yeshua so rightly says 'the master needs no sucessor'. What I speak of is not numerology so please David learn before you condemn. I speak of gematria that is part of sacred geometry.

Dear Sharon

Thank you I intend too, the light workers in Israel have been absolutely amazing, they are so POSITIVE, supportive and loving that I feel like I AM going home. I never dreamed that I would have the good fortune to go to the Holy Land let alone be sent to go on a very sacred mission for the divine. I am truly blessed and will let you have a report on my return if I ever recover from this trip. For sure it will change my life forever, never to be the same again. A friend said 'what a great privilege' my response is that it feels like a great deal of responsibility right now especially as we are fulfilling biblical prophecy that will impact on the world. Overwhelming yes, and makes one feel very humble indeed, so thank God that there are many people to catch me the other end and the divine leading me and us on the way..........

Take care of you special person.

Divine Love

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Hello David,

You may well be right about the 1917/18 bird 'flu/Spanish 'flu outbreak. People in those days kept chickens as a matter of course for fresh eggs and meat, and this was extended to the WW1 trenches. It illustrates my point that in order for humans to catch this bird 'flu, they'd need to be around hens and poultry 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. A human can't simply catch bird 'flu from one encounter, or from never having been around birds. The greater, more deadly danger, comes from human strains of 'flu, and these would make a far better biological weapon (qv.) This bird 'flu would only present a real danger if it managed to mutate from bird to a human form of influenza, then we'd all be in trouble.

I may be totally wrong in this assumption David, I don't know, but my view on why we haven't had a spread of such a flu since 1917/18, is because we have given up our personal poultry stocks over time, and therefore because people no longer spend enough time around these birds for the flu to present any real danger, this is the reason why there hasn't been another outbreak. I might be wrong though, but it does seem as if these human casualites are linked to spending time around hens and chickens, and even then, humans catching it cannot be guaranteed, unlike human 'flu, which spreads like wildfire through unvaccinated human populations.

Love,
Patsy.
xxxx

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Your reasoning sounds good to me, Patsy. So the remaining threat is from south-east Asia where people do live intimately with these birds, and dispose of them unhygenically.

V xxx

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Hi David,

Yes, from the pictures shown on TV, (not a good medium, I know) the birds in South East Asia aren't kept in hygienic conditions at all, and moreover, their keepers are around them a lot of the time. When the birds die, they're just put into sacks and dumped anywhere, thereby spreading the virus around to the local population, many of whom work and live close to where the bird carcasses are dumped. I am not surprised to hear that most human deaths from avian 'fluhave been linked to this region. Again, I may be entirely wrong, and that this bird 'flu presents a far greater threat to us, but I can only go by observation and reading about how the bird 'flu evolves and spreads.

Radio 4 did a hilarious take on the swan found in Scotland with the H5N1 virus, a little while ago. It was assumed that the dead swan died whilst on a migration flight from Germany, and these 'wags' did a little sketch featuring the swan as a German Luftwaffe swan, in radio contact with its base, and talking in hyped-up Teutonic tones, in that daft, tinny voice,on a mission to infect Great Britain with the bird 'flu.As it moved in for the 'kill', it suddenly radioed to 'control', saying, 'I'm flying over the North Sea and I feel awful.' A large splash was then heard, and the 'mission' had to be aborted. Hilarious!

Love,
Patsy.
😀

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

I thought Radio 4 was the kind of 'place' where you'd also get irate listeners writing in and complaining that the subject couldn't be funny! 😉

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

ORIGINAL: venetian

I thought Radio 4 was the kind of 'place' where you'd also get irate listeners writing in and complaining that the subject couldn't be funny! 😉

V

It sounds like good potential for that to happen in this instance! 😀

From memory and what I've read, and without checking for sources ... bird flu is caught by the inhalation (by humans) of dust from dried bird faeces that are left lying around. Someone can correct me if I got that wrong.

Holistic

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

You're absolutely right, Laura. Humans catch this bird 'flu from inhaling dust and microbes from the chicken faeces.

Love,
Patsy.
xxxxx

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

V I thought Radio 4 was the kind of 'place' where you'd also get irate listeners writing in and complaining that the subject couldn't be funny!

In defence of Radio 4: it's just the sort of place where you would hear a first rate comedy sketch about bird 'flu, as well as some of the most intelligent brains in Britain (present company excepted)engaging in informed debate about it. I ampassionateabout Radio 4.Many excellent TV shows started there. I can't praise it enough. Except the Archers. I wish someone would shoot the Grundies.

Sharon.

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Radio 4 - well worth the licence fee. There are only two programmes I hate listening to - one is 'The Archers' and the other is 'Something Understood', which is broadcast early and late on Sundays. The content is good, but since it is made up of loud music, which can be very stirring, it is inappropriate at 6am on a Sunday morning, and at 11.30pm on a Sunday night. Other than these two, I love to listen to Radio 4.

I have also noticed that Radio 4 will broadcast programmes dealing with off-beat subjects in a clear and informative way. For example, twice now I have come across programmes looking into ghosts andthe afterlife, and both were dealt with positively and scientifically, and with the biastoward peoples' experiences, instead of trotting out a load of hard-line sceptics, ready to rubbish the experiences of sane and rational people.

Well done, Radio 4!

Love,
Patsy.
😀

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

I can't say I listen to R4, but it sure has given birth to amazing TV. My all-time favourite is still "Whose Line Is It Anyway?" which began on R4 - and where is it now? There was a disastrous US TVincarnation of it, which probably killed it!

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

WellV I think you might like R4. Andrew Marr's Start the Week (Mon 9am), whichis a chat type show witha variety of guests (next week David Hare and DJ Taylor)and Melvyn Bragg's "In out time" (Thurs 10am- I'm going to put a bit of his newsletter about last weeks subject "Astronomy and Empire" on the pyramid and yogic hopping thread.)
Sharon.

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

Hi Sharon,

I've no doubtI would like R4. It's just a matter of habit and how to spend your time. When abroad I did in the Cold War (living behind the Iron Curtain) pick up the habit of hearing the World Service every day, as it was the only thing you could trust for the news.

In factI got into "cult radio" as Moscow got very near to the same frequency and tried to imitate the WS. It was absolutely hilarious and one of the funniest times of my life, as the Moscowvites imitated the BBC accent, but the "news" was hilariously propaganda (and TBH honest I hated them). But there was more! In the tone of voice you could tell that even the announcers in Moscow knew it was all a load of cods, so even they, by tone, were having a joke.

If you want the honest truth, it was the big event of every Sunday morning, as I used to play it with my Polish wife and imitate the Moscow- BBC accent. The last I recall, it had us in such stitches that I fell out of bed, helplessly laughing andbum-naked 😀

V

RE: Bird flu, any flu—stop the fear

What interesting little snippets we get of your life V!

Next Mon - Start the WeekSIR DAVID HARE talks about his latest play, an adaptation of Maxim Gorky's Enemies, a play about unrest between workers and factory owners in Russia before the revolution. Despite being written exactly a hundred years ago, the play's themes of social and moral conflict, and its questioning of whether our beliefs are led by our social circumstances, are surprisingly current

And In our Time is about "Faeries".........