I hope I don’t offend anyone by posting this but I feel I have to say something about what the Bible says about psychics, mediums etc.
The Bible, both in the Old and New testaments warns against going to psychics and mediums, however I guess throughout the ages people have consulted psychics, mediums etc – particularly when life is hard – after a bereavement, relationship breakdown, job worries and so on. I have known friends and colleagues use psychics and I myself have.
However I do now believe the Bible to be true and makes the points for very good reasons. Throughout the time I have used psychics, very few (if any) predictions have come true (and I have used supposedly reputable psychics). I have actually been given a lot of mis-information about situations which has proved heartbreaking. To be frank, I could have saved myself an awful lot of time and money if I hadn’t gone to them, as they have been a complete and utter waste of time. Ditto my friends who have used psychics as well – they feel used. Most people go to psychics to gain information about particular situations. If false info is given, then the person having the reading can be led up the wrong path completely.
As I said, I do now believe the Bible does have a point (for a very good reason) and will never, ever use them again.
Now, I have returned home to my Catholic faith. I feel more Catholic than I ever have. I guess that I never had a strong faith before. I went through New Age phase, but I am over it now. And, now I pray for the dead, instead of trying to contact them.
That's beautiful Janna! 🙂
especially if you don't believe in life after death which I assume doesn't fall in with the teachings of the Churches,
Peter - you assume wrong!
Many prayers in Christian churches end with the words, "life after death, amen"
A very central point of orthodox Christianity is that Jesus rose from the grave on that first Easter morning so that we could have life after death.
What about the Transfiguration, when Jesus talked with Moses and Elijah?
Matthew 17, Mark 9
And there are about 50 references to eternal life - a few in the OT, but most in the NT - Psalms 16, Daniel 12, All through the gospels and in the various letters. Here are just a couple:
John 4:14
whoever drinks the water I give them will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give them will become in them a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”
1 John 2:25 And this is what he promised us—eternal life.
Love and peace,
Judy
Peter - you assume wrong!
Many prayers in Christian churches end with the words, "life after death, amen"
A very central point of orthodox Christianity is that Jesus rose from the grave on that first Easter morning so that we could have life after death.
What about the Transfiguration, when Jesus talked with Moses and Elijah?
Matthew 17, Mark 9And there are about 50 references to eternal life - a few in the OT, but most in the NT - Psalms 16, Daniel 12, All through the gospels and in the various letters. Here are just a couple:
Love and peace,
Judy
Hi
I suppose it might just be me but I am under the impression that churches do not believe in life after death, there are so many references, for instance on the gravestones it is carved on the may you rest in peace, if the churches knew of life after death this would not be the instance, because when we pass over into the next level and other levels we do not rest we have a lot more to do, without a cumbersome earthly body.
Also there is life before this incarnation, this is not the first time we have been on the earth, is this accepted by the Church?
I do not see that the word amen classifies that the Church believes in life after death, just because it is in the Bible it doesn't mean it is accepted in the context that is intended.
“Amen” is a Hebrew word; it means “verily”, “certainly”. It was taken over into the Christian liturgy as the closing word, as assent and reaffirmation for the prayer and for the Blessing in the sense of: “So be it!” or “Yea, let it be done accordingly!”
But the word has yet another, a higher meaning, when we read in the 3rd chapter of John’s Revelation verse 14: “And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;”
Here, the Will of God, the Fountain-Head of all Being, the “A and the O”, the “Beginning and the End”, is referred to as “Amen”. His Name is “Imanuel” which contains the letters of the word “Amen”.
I'm afraid I must be a bit antichurch person, I don't believe I lot of what the church was built on, such as when Jesus was murdered they called it a sacrifice, I cannot accept that God would send his Son to the earth just be murdered, I believe his path was to lead us back to Paradise in his word, not in his death!
Also I do not accept that a priest sin can forgive someone when he hasn't been the person sinned against.
Also what we do for God in the serving a church (nothing), in the beginning was the earth and God, then up popped the churches saying we must follow them and what they understand of the Bible, they spoke in the churches in Latin, they just as well have spoken in Siamese people would still not have been able to understand them.
We need a medium to talk to the dead, we do not need a church to talk to God!
There is more much much more, the murderers during the Inquisition etc.
Peace and light
Peter
It's OK Peter - I don't believe in much of what some denominations teach which has come out of a very literal, material interpretation of the Bible or from the opinions of men either.
But life after death and eternal life certainly is there. I don't quite know quite what they mean when they say "rest in peace" - I think it's a hope that people will no longer have the cares and anxieties. Whatever..... As for amen, you're reading far too much into what I wrote. Prayers end with it and the words, "life after death" and also "life without end" are simply the last line before the amen in many prayers in various churches.
I think it's far more important to concentrate on working out our own salvation - our own relationship with God, than getting worked up about what others are or aren't doing, what others believe or don't believe. I feel that Christians should all be trying to emulate the Master Christian in all his words - and works - and that includes healing.
Love and peace,
Judy
[quote=Principled;717580
I don't quite know quite what they mean when they say "rest in peace"
”Rest in Peace” dates back to a time when Christians believed (or, at least, the church taught) that the soul stayed in the grave until the final call to Judgement Day, when the dead would rise and be judged by God.
This isn’t really that long ago – only a hundred years or so. And devout Muslims still believe it (or, as I said before, are taught it).
”Rest in Peace” dates back to a time when Christians believed (or, at least, the church taught) that the soul stayed in the grave until the final call to Judgement Day, when the dead would rise and be judged by God.
This isn’t really that long ago – only a hundred years or so. And devout Muslims still believe it (or, as I said before, are taught it).
Thanks Crowan - all those skeletons rising up out of the graves! Shudder! I wonder what they would make of cremations? :rolleyes: Actually, come to think of it, it's probably why most Catholics get buried.
It's OK Peter - I don't believe in much of what some denominations teach which has come out of a very literal, material interpretation of the Bible or from the opinions of men either.
But life after death and eternal life certainly is there. I don't quite know quite what they mean when they say "rest in peace" - I think it's a hope that people will no longer have the cares and anxieties. Whatever..... As for amen, you're reading far too much into what I wrote. Prayers end with it and the words, "life after death" and also "life without end" are simply the last line before the amen in many prayers in various churches.
I think it's far more important to concentrate on working out our own salvation - our own relationship with God, than getting worked up about what others are or aren't doing, what others believe or don't believe. I feel that Christians should all be trying to emulate the Master Christian in all his words - and works - and that includes healing.
Love and peace,
Judy
Hi there
It’s nice to hear from someone who thinks very similar to me a lot of people follow the opinions of men and their interpretations of the Bible which they pass on to other people in their teachings.
Yes I apologise about reading in the Amen to much!
I accept what you say and concentrate on working out our own salvation!
When a person passes over with false beliefs they become a barrier to his rising to the higher levels in creation, the Earth is I believe the only level where good and bad are side-by-side, and we form our own opinions, in terms of faith and the truth we must take with us.
If we do not recognise the truth while we are on the Earth as I have said this becomes a barrier when we pass over and prevents us from rising to the more luminous realms, as when we pass over it is a lot harder to throw off wrong opinions and takes a very strong spirit to do so or accept that they were wrong while on the Earth, and many people cannot accept they were wrong.
The teachers that pass on the wrong opinions in teachings are I assume also lost, for a leading the sheep to destruction unless they wake in time and lead the ones to the truth where they have professed lies and false opinions!
I only tried to wake up as many people as possible to prevent this, as I try to work with the truth.
Peace and light
Peter
Thanks Crowan - all those skeletons rising up out of the graves! Shudder! I wonder what they would make of cremations? :rolleyes: Actually, come to think of it, it's probably why most Catholics get buried.
Hi again
do you honestly believe that all of the bodies rise, as the Jehovah's Witnesses do I believe, my mind is a little bit vague at the moment, but I believe if I remember rightly that the resurrection mentioned of all that is dead, refers to all the spiritually dead, that will arise for the judgement.
Not all the dead.
It doesn't matter whether you are buried or cremated!
Peace and light
Peter
Hi again
do you honestly believe that all of the bodies rise, as the Jehovah's Witnesses do I believe, .
Oh good grief no I don't believe that!! 😀 That was the old orthodox belief, but hopefully it's dying out now - pun intended!
Our true and eternal identity is spiritual right here and now - the mortal body is like the chrysalis of a caterpillar. The butterfly can never return to being a caterpillar (or the oak tree to an acorn)
When a person passes over with false beliefs they become a barrier to his rising to the higher levels in creation, the Earth is I believe the only level where good and bad are side-by-side, and we form our own opinions, in terms of faith and the truth we must take with us.
If we do not recognise the truth while we are on the Earth as I have said this becomes a barrier when we pass over and prevents us from rising to the more luminous realms, as when we pass over it is a lot harder to throw off wrong opinions and takes a very strong spirit to do so or accept that they were wrong while on the Earth, and many people cannot accept they were wrong.
The teachers that pass on the wrong opinions in teachings are I assume also lost, for a leading the sheep to destruction unless they wake in time and lead the ones to the truth where they have professed lies and false opinions!
As I said somewhere at the beginning of this thread, none of us here has yet passed through the change called death, so most of it is speculation. From the accounts I've read of near-death experiences, it seems that some people experience what we would describe as hell, but it's a hell of their own making and there is always a light by them. All they have to do is to reach out for the light, but many are so wallowing in their own misery that they simply don't see it. From these experiences and understanding that the true identity of all of us is God-like, pure, innocent, perfect, I truly believe that everyone has the opportunity to reform their thinking, to rise in their spiritual consciousness and to draw nearer to God - the Source of all Being, with whom we are already one, but just aren't aware of it yet, but yes, I also feel that we should make the most of earth's preparatory school and do the most good we can here.
Mary Baker Eddy, a Christian reformer and healer, observed:
[COLOR="Blue"]
If the Principle, rule, and demonstration of man’s being are not in the least understood before what is termed death overtakes mortals, they will rise no higher spiritually in the scale of existence on account of that single experience, but will remain as material as before the transition, still seeking happiness through a material, instead of through a spiritual sense of life, and from selfish and inferior motives.(Science and Health 290)
The sin and error which possess us at the instant of death do not cease at that moment, but endure until the death of these errors. To be wholly spiritual, man must be sinless, and he becomes thus only when he reaches perfection. The murderer, though slain in the act, does not thereby forsake sin. He is no more spiritual for believing that his body died and learning that his cruel mind died not. His thoughts are no purer until evil is disarmed by good. His body is as material as his mind, and vice versa. (Science and Health 290)
Existence continues to be a belief of corporeal sense until the Science of being is reached. Error brings its own self-destruction both here and hereafter, for mortal mind creates its own physical conditions. Death will occur on the next plane of existence as on this, until the spiritual understanding of Life is reached. Then, and not until then, will it be demonstrated that “the second death hath no power.”
The period required for this dream of material life, embracing its so-called pleasures and pains, to vanish from consciousness, “knoweth no man . . . neither the Son, but the Father.” This period will be of longer or shorter duration according to the tenacity of error. (Science and Health p 77)
[COLOR="Black"]And this one is particularly relevant to the topic of this thread:
[COLOR="Blue"]If the departed are in rapport with mortality, or matter, they are not spiritual, but must still be mortal, sinning, suffering, and dying. Then why look to them — even were communication possible — for proofs of immortality, and accept them as oracles? (Science and Health p 78)
Love and peace,
Judy
As I said somewhere at the beginning of this thread, none of us here has yet passed through the change called death, so most of it is speculation. From the accounts I've read of near-death experiences, it seems that some people experience what we would describe as hell, but it's a hell of their own making and there is always a light by them. All they have to do is to reach out for the light, but many are so wallowing in their own misery that they simply don't see it. From these experiences and understanding that the true identity of all of us is God-like, pure, innocent, perfect, I truly believe that everyone has the opportunity to reform their thinking, to rise in their spiritual consciousness and to draw nearer to God - the Source of all Being, with whom we are already one, but just aren't aware of it yet, but yes, I also feel that we should make the most of earth's preparatory school and do the most good we can here.
Mary Baker Eddy, a Christian reformer and healer, observed:
If the Principle, rule, and demonstration of man’s being are not in the least understood before what is termed death overtakes mortals, they will rise no higher spiritually in the scale of existence on account of that single experience, but will remain as material as before the transition, still seeking happiness through a material, instead of through a spiritual sense of life, and from selfish and inferior motives.(Science and Health 290)
The sin and error which possess us at the instant of death do not cease at that moment, but endure until the death of these errors. To be wholly spiritual, man must be sinless, and he becomes thus only when he reaches perfection. The murderer, though slain in the act, does not thereby forsake sin. He is no more spiritual for believing that his body died and learning that his cruel mind died not. His thoughts are no purer until evil is disarmed by good. His body is as material as his mind, and vice versa. (Science and Health 290)
Existence continues to be a belief of corporeal sense until the Science of being is reached. Error brings its own self-destruction both here and hereafter, for mortal mind creates its own physical conditions. Death will occur on the next plane of existence as on this, until the spiritual understanding of Life is reached. Then, and not until then, will it be demonstrated that “the second death hath no power.”
The period required for this dream of material life, embracing its so-called pleasures and pains, to vanish from consciousness, “knoweth no man . . . neither the Son, but the Father.” This period will be of longer or shorter duration according to the tenacity of error. (Science and Health p 77)
And this one is particularly relevant to the topic of this thread:
If the departed are in rapport with mortality, or matter, they are not spiritual, but must still be mortal, sinning, suffering, and dying. Then why look to them — even were communication possible — for proofs of immortality, and accept them as oracles? (Science and Health p 78)
Love and peace,
Judy
You say none of us has yet passed through the change called death, so most of it is speculation.
I do not agree with this, one incarnation, being this one is not enough to reach the higher levels in creation we do not experience enough to rise.
I believe we have been here many times and there is no one on the earth at this time that has been here only the once, but we are close to our last incarnation, if not the last!
Yes we should make the most of Earth's preparatory school and do the most good that we can here as on the other levels if we are given the grace to reach them.
We are only given so much time to come to fruition, and we had experience at each incarnation and we carry all the experiences from or previous incarnations with us now.
That is why Jesus the Son of God came to the to show us the way back and not to fall in perdition!
The Akashic level records each time that we are on the earth (<a class="go2wpf-bbcode" rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href=" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akashic_records "> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akashic_records again many people will not accept that this as it doesn't fall in with their thoughts or wishes, but you can only put a mask on the truth, and truth is eternal!
This is the level I assume, many people would call the book of life.
I believe everyone has an ingrained longing for God, a lot of people try to replace this longing or quench the thirst in this longing, with material, which material can never satisfy the longing, which is why the yearning for material never goes away no matter how many millions they make!
You say that everyone has the opportunity to reform their thinking to rise to this protocol is and draw nearer to God, I agree nearer to God yes, but while on the earth if we take our beliefs with us it can prevent us from rising as I have said, the wrong beliefs form a barrier.
(The paragraph from size in health 290) I cannot grasp it completely certain parts that I do grasp, I think I agree with intellectually by putting it into simpler terms, without I can understand with my intellect.
Peace and light
Peter
Oh good grief no I don't believe that!! 😀 That was the old orthodox belief, but hopefully it's dying out now - pun intended!
Our true and eternal identity is spiritual right here and now - the mortal body is like the chrysalis of a caterpillar. The butterfly can never return to being a caterpillar (or the oak tree to an acorn)
an excellent way to put it!
Everything in creation is a radiation.
Peace and light
Peter
Happygirl,
In the interests of balance and after reading your post I just had to step in here. I have been a practising Spiritualist medium for 24 years. I have come across all types of clients from all backgrounds, wanting to know the future and so on. Nobody can predict it. However, what I gather from yours and your friend's experiences with psychics, I just want to make a couple of points:
You/your friend sat with three psychics and they all came up with similar readings. Why? Don't you think it was because all of them were 'reading' your auras and hence picking up on what you/friend wanted to hear? Why is it then the psychics' fault?
Why do you deem yourself a 'victim' of 'charlatan' psychics, when you and your friend chose to visit them? Nobody pulled you in off the streets.
If you were unhappy with your readings, why did you pay for them?
Your post illustrates problems that mediums have with sitters who want them to say what they want to hear. It is interesting that your friend received three messages, all saying the same thing - that means that she was projecting this in her aura and the psychics were picking up on it. Don't blame them.
It is up to you whether you visit a medium again, but I'd say this - don't blame anyone except yourself if your reading isn't going well. That's some professional advice for free.
”Rest in Peace” dates back to a time when Christians believed (or, at least, the church taught) that the soul stayed in the grave until the final call to Judgement Day, when the dead would rise and be judged by God.
This isn’t really that long ago – only a hundred years or so. And devout Muslims still believe it (or, as I said before, are taught it).
Very well said Crowan :). God knows the heart of every person. Only God knows whether a person in his or her last moments cried out to Jesus forgiveness. Death can be considered merely a change of address for those who love Jesus. 🙂
Very well said Crowan :). God knows the heart of every person. Only God knows whether a person in his or her last moments cried out to Jesus forgiveness. Death can be considered merely a change of address for those who love Jesus. 🙂
Sorry - I'm not understanding the line between what I posted (which was historical fact) and your reply (which was about a god I don't follow).
The subject of Christian Science pops up with some regularity in these forums. The following is a short introduction to an encounter between a certain gentleman by the name of Lance Messmule and a CS practitioner.
I wonder, are their any members of this forum knowledgeable enough in the ways of Christian Science to comment on this encounter?
This last summer, when I was on my way back to Vienna from the Appetite-Cure in the mountains, I fell over a cliff in the twilight, and broke some arms and legs and one thing or another, and by good luck was found by some peasants who had lost an ass, and they carried me to the nearest habitation, which was one of those large, low, thatch-roofed farm-houses, with apartments in the garret for the family, and a cunning little porch under the deep gable decorated with boxes of bright colored flowers and cats; on the ground floor a large and light sitting-room, separated from the milch-cattle apartment by a partition; and in the front yard rose stately and fine the wealth and pride of the house, the manure-pile. That sentence is Germanic, and shows that I am acquiring that sort of mastery of the art and spirit of the language which enables a man to travel all day in one sentence without changing cars.
There was a village a mile away, and a horse doctor lived there, but there was no surgeon. It seemed a bad outlook; mine was distinctly a surgery case. Then it was remembered that a lady from Boston was summering in that village, and she was a Christian Science doctor and could cure anything. So she was sent for. It was night by this time, and she could not conveniently come, but sent word that it was no matter, there was no hurry, she would give me "absent treatment" now, and come in the morning; meantime she begged me to make myself tranquil and comfortable and remember that there was nothing the matter with me. I thought there must be some mistake.
"Did you tell her I walked off a cliff seventy-five feet high?"
"Yes."
"And struck a boulder at the bottom and bounced?"
"Yes."
"And struck another one and bounced again?"
"Yes."
"And struck another one and bounced yet again?"
"Yes."
"And broke the boulders?"
"Yes."
"That accounts for it; she is thinking of the boulders. Why didn't you tell her I got hurt, too?"
"I did. I told her what you told me to tell her: that you were now but an incoherent series of compound fractures extending from your scalp-lock to your heels, and that the comminuted projections caused you to look like a hat-rack."
"And it was after this that she wished me to remember that there was nothing the matter with me?"
"Those were her words."
"I do not understand it. I believe she has not diagnosed the case with sufficient care. Did she look like a person who was theorizing, or did she look like one who has fallen off precipices herself and brings to the aid of abstract science the confirmations of personal experience?"
"Bitte?"
It was too large a contract for the Stubenmadchen's vocabulary; she couldn't call the hand. I allowed the subject to rest there, and asked for something to eat and smoke, and something hot to drink, and a basket to pile my legs in; but I could not have any of these things.
"Why?"
"She said you would need nothing at all."
"But I am hungry and thirsty, and in desperate pain."
"She said you would have these delusions, but must pay no attention to them. She wants you to particularly remember that there are no such things as hunger and thirst and pain.''
"She does does she?"
"It is what she said."
"Does she seem to be in full and functionable possession of her intellectual plant, such as it is?"
"Bitte?"
"Do they let her run at large, or do they tie her up?"
"Tie her up?"
"There, good-night, run along, you are a good girl, but your mental Geschirr is not arranged for light and airy conversation. Leave me to my delusions."
Sorry about the horrible formatting but I can't find the edit option.
Eta, I found it, but it doesn't look to bad now, the font's a bit big but never mind.
The subject of Christian Science pops up with some regularity in these forums. The following is a short introduction to an encounter between a certain gentleman by the name of Lance Messmule and a CS practitioner.
I wonder, are their any members of this forum knowledgeable enough in the ways of Christian Science to comment on this encounter?
Hi
Its an interesting story. Can you supply the ending. Did this person benefit from the CS practitioners efforts.
Hi Boson Higgs,
The passage you've quoted is from Mark Twain's satirical book Christian Science, which he published in 1907, though he started writing the material for it nearly a decade earlier. That excerpt, from the introduction, is an entirely fictional (and quite amusing) account of Twain's purported encounter with a Christian Science practitioner in Germany, intended as a send-up of Christian Science, or at least of Christian Science as Twain interpreted it.
This is quite an intriguing topic to delve into, as Mark Twain had an unusual sort of love-hate relationship with Christian Science during the last couple of decades of his life. On one hand, its founder Mary Baker Eddy was an utterly absurd figure to him - a woman who devised a radically different theology, founded her own church, and was financially successful by her own efforts - and therefore a good target for his ridicule. On the other hand, he couldn't help admitting (only sometimes openly) that many of her basic theological ideas actually appealed to him. But he was deeply conflicted over matters of religion and faith, and apparently could never quite bring himself to examine Christian Science seriously and impartially.
I don't want to take the thread off topic, but I'm happy to discuss this particular subject further if others are interested.
With love,
Charis
Thanks for the reply Charis. And yes, I'm fully aware who Lance Messmule (Samuel Clemens) is.;)
Yes Twain apparently did have some belief that mental healing could work under certain conditions ie, "Imagination-manufactured disease". But he openly mocked Baker Eddy in his later years.
Regarding your quote:
"Mark Twain had an unusual sort of love-hate relationship with Christian Science during the last couple of decades of his life".
The only cite I can find for this quote is from a Christian Science website, I can find nothing from an independent source.
Now regarding the subject of this thread: 'What Christianity has to say about psychics'.
Does it matter what Christians have to to say on the subject? Given that very few, if any, Christians advocate death for those who work on a Sabbath or that lippy kids be stoned to death. So why not suffer a few witches to live? I mean they burned thousands of the poor buggers in the sixteenth century. So as I see it, it's a moot point.
But I digress, I will now get straight to the point. Over the years many hundreds of thoughtful intelligent topics on this website have been corrupted with the blatherings of Baker Eddy. And few members have had the temerity to challenge these assertions. Till now.
Eddy Baker was a money hungry charlatan. A good number of good people died slow horrible deaths as a direct result of her, teachings. In this thread alone it has been asserted that Eddy Baker brought the dead back to life.
Show Me!
I will leave you with this:
"From end to end of the Christian Science literature not a single (material) thing in the world is conceded to be real, except the Dollar."
Lance Messmule.
Hi
Its an interesting story. Can you supply the ending. Did this person benefit from the CS practitioners efforts.
Forgive me scommstech I did not intend to be rude but I think my last post answered your question. And for Mark Twains full take on things, have a look here:
Satire at it's best.
Thing is, people don't have to consult psychics, mediums or anyone of that ilk if they don't want to, so why pick on them?
Gets my goat.
Patsy.
C
But I digress, I will now get straight to the point. Over the years many hundreds of thoughtful intelligent topics on this website have been corrupted with the blatherings of Baker Eddy. And few members have had the temerity to challenge these assertions. Till now.
One thing I have noticed is that the Christian Scientists on HP manage to put their points across without ever being rude.
Any other style of Christian can join in. As, indeed, can those of us who are not Christians. Where's the "corruption"?
C
One thing I have noticed is that the Christian Scientists on HP manage to put their points across without ever being rude.
Any other style of Christian can join in. As, indeed, can those of us who are not Christians. Where's the "corruption"?
You single out one word in that post but fail to address any of the points I raise.
I addressed the point that struck me as important.
What points would you like me to address?
Forgive me scommstech I did not intend to be rude but I think my last post answered your question. And for Mark Twains full take on things, have a look here:
Satire at it's best.
Hi
I do not claim to be a Christian Scientist although I have great respect for Mrs Eddy.
I like to think that I am gaining a little insight into Quantum Science principles and discoveries. So far I have found nothing to contradict Christian Science teachings.
In fact Mrs Eddy seems to have advocated Quantum principles years ahead of traditional science. I do admit though that the terminology may be different but most of the core essence is the same as far as our capability to heal and our subjection to a higher order.
I addressed the point that struck me as important.
What points would you like me to address?
And the charge that people died as a direct result of her teachings is a trivial thing? Or the claim that Baker Eddy cured blindness and raised people from the dead?
Crowan please note I don't expect in depth apologetics on your part, afaics you have no dog in this race, you have made no outrageous claims. Others have, and I find it quite telling we have no response yet.
Crowan please note I don't expect in depth apologetics on your part.
Just as well, really.
And the charge that people died as a direct result of her teachings is a trivial thing? Or the claim that Baker Eddy cured blindness and raised people from the dead?
Judging purely by previous arguments on HP, I suspect that you could get your points answered if they were plainly put – maybe in the form of a question (“What is your response to the claim …”) rather than as a challenge, buried in what comes over as a rather aggressive post.
This is the part you snipped...
afaics you have no dog in this race, you have made no outrageous claims. Others have, and I find it quite telling we have no response yet.
You criticize my posting style as being aggressive yet you edit my posts without explanation, I find that quite rude. If you insist on editing my posts please add a small note explaining why.
Anyway, what is your response to the claim that people died needlessly as a direct result of following the creeds of Mary Baker Eddy. The resurrection issue is clearly a little heavy at the moment but we can resurrect it later.
I edited your post in order to make it clear which part I was referring to.
I have no response to the rest. I am not a Christian, as I have said before. I have quite different beliefs. I am happy to bow out now and leave the responses to those who both know and care more about Christianity.