Visions of angels and protection during WW1

Thanks Nah-meed - they say there are no atheists in a battle!

What has October got to do with superstition? I understand the superstition about the 13th.

The angels vision didn't come to men who were dying - or under morphine. There are some of the accounts of them here: If you scroll down about half way to the poster " Angels of Mons Valse, Paul Paree" you can read some of the accounts there. There were about a hundred soldiers on both sides who reported seeing the angels.

Love and peace,

Judy

I never got myself and my head around superstition. I have heard about friday 13th but never took it seriously. I understand if people do my wife is a witch and has been for 30 years she is superstiition. My belief is to respect any differances of beliefs or ideals. It should be embraced.and learned from.
I was born on friday 13th of October so i have never given it much head space.
Speak soon i hope.

Be free from suffering.
Never be near to the causes of suffering.
May you find happiness.and always be near to the causes of happiness.

I was born on friday 13th of October so i have never given it much head space.

Very sensible!

Whatever we believe in, we bring into our experience.
I saw a documentary once about a woman who believed that bad luck followed her around. One day, she was driving through Richmond Park when she thought she heard a noise with her car. She stopped and got out and a dead duck came flying through the air and hit her on the head and injured her. Now, tell me, what are the statistical chances of being hit by a dead duck while in Richmond Park? That’s the trouble with believing in luck – you have to have the bad with the good! Consciousness is primary, not matter.

I did a search about 13th of October but could find nothing except a Wall Street crash, so I can't imagine why soldiers think it's so unlucky. However, I'm presently having a mini break in lovely Hastings and yesterday we went to Battle. The Battle of Hastings was on October 14th 1066, when the English army was defeated and annihilated by the Normans who had come over from France. I wonder whether someone got the date wrong?
The WW1 soldiers I have been researching believed in only one power - good, or God and see what wonderful protection they had when they refused to admit any other power.

Go in peace,

Judy

I asked around about the Friday the 13th.
First i was told that when Julius ceasor was assisinated each of the pretagonist of which numbered 13 had to stab him.
I also heard that many years ago that a French king ordered the killing of all the templar nights on Friday the 13th through out the whole of Europe.
This intrigues me as it falls into my sphere of interest.

Some people i have read a long time if i recall believe that which Astrological sign we come under can denote our beliefs.
For instance Gemini signs or air signs tend to be more prone to such beliefs however,air signs that come under the Libra or scales sign tend to be more proof orientated and sceptical.
I believe there is a place for superstition as some of the stories are enchanting.
I agree the human concsciousness is primary.
As for the lady with the dead duck hitting her on the head i would say that was good luck it could have been worse it could have been a Stork going to the story of them carrying babies.
Or maybe she should have just DUCKED Lol

Hi Nahmeed,

If you look up Wiki there's an explanation of the origins of the superstition. The Oct 13th thing seems to be the story about the Knights Templars, but as that came from Dan brown's Da Vinci Code, it's a load of b............ oops, make believe! :rolleyes:

Anyway, I must get back to the wonderful accounts of divine protection for some of the soldiers of WW1 soon! I think the thread has been off-topic for long enough now.

Love and peace,

Judy

There does seem to be many tales of this the main one seems to be the Angel of Mons.
Looking deeper retreating british soldiers report see St George appear with a force of bowmen which halted the germans.
It is certainly something that is not to be scoffed at after all no matter what you call your God for these accounts must have substance.

There does seem to be many tales of this the main one seems to be the Angel of Mons.
Looking deeper retreating british soldiers report see St George appear with a force of bowmen which halted the germans.
It is certainly something that is not to be scoffed at after all no matter what you call your God for these accounts must have substance.

Yes, thanks Nahmeed

There were hundreds of reports from both sides - there was also, at the end of the war, another sighting that was named, "The White Cavalry" but I'll get to that one later! Yes, stress and extreme fatigue can make someone hallucinate, but would a hallucination cause a moral reformation and redemption? What I find sad is the way that these accounts have been largely excluded from military history.

Love and peace,

Judy

Shell shock

The total number (from all countries) of [url]military and civilian casualties in WW1[/url] was over 37 million. (the mind boggles) There were over 16 million deaths and 20 million wounded ranking it among the deadliest conflicts in human history. Among these casualties, were at least 80,000 cases of “shell shock” dealt with by the British army. The worst cases were during the “Battle of the Somme”. Over 20,000 men had been killed on the very first day, when the men were ordered to leave their trenches and go “over the top” amidst continual bombardment. Some 35,000 men broke down from shell shock during that battle, which lasted for 5 months over a front of 30 km.

This rather disturbing (but well made) documentary gives an idea of the conditions 100 years ago: .

Shell shock

As symptoms on this scale had never been seen before during warfare, some officers assumed that the men were cowards and malingerers (especially those who tried to run away from the battlefields) and they were shot at dawn – reason, “lacking moral fibre” or treason.

Some of you may remember, that as a result of a campaign by the families of the 306 British men who were executed for LMF, they were given a posthumous pardon by the government, back in 2006.

While searching the 100 year old issues of the Christian Science periodicals, I have found about a dozen testimonies of healing of shell shock and thought I’d share a couple with you – proof again of the healing, sustaining and protecting power of God, divine Love, that is present and powerful, right in the middle of the most horrible circumstances, if we only choose to reach out for it. There is a higher reality than what limiting and destructive matter screams at us. It is “the peace of God, which passeth all understanding…” (Philippians 4:7)

During the First World War I served with His Majesty's Forces overseas and experienced severe shell shock, which brought on neurasthenia in a severe form. After spending many months in hospital, I was discharged and pronounced unfit for any further military service. My health gradually became worse, until one day I was seized with an epileptic fit, which rendered me unconscious for over two hours. A doctor who was called in not only pronounced the case incurable, but said that the attacks would become more frequent as time went on. I accepted this verdict and became filled with fear….

Then he was introduced to Christian Science and ……

Through quiet study and sincerity I began to see that all true consciousness is spiritual and that it is impossible for man as the image and likeness of God to become unconscious. I began to appreciate and enjoy a measure of health and happiness I had never known before;…

Later a great flood of light came to me when it was pointed out to me that I must realize that there never had been a war in God's kingdom and that I must give up the belief that I was suffering from effects of that which had never happened to God's idea, who is always in His kingdom. Suddenly I saw what had been happening: I had been cherishing and almost idolizing four war medals and special ribbons awarded to me as trophies of the First World War, and yet at the same time I had been earnestly striving to see the unreality of war's effects. This was so illuminating to me that the whole burden was lifted, and every trace of the trouble left for good. This clear spiritual discernment was wonderful to me, and I shall ever be grateful for it. George Frederick Hall, Stourbridge, Worcestershire, England
We read in the Bible that Jesus..."

And here is the other:

“I was suffering from shell shock, an injured leg, and other injuries received in the First World War….”
Having refused a major operation on my leg, the success of which could not be guaranteed, I was told that nothing more could be done for me, and I was placed on a lifetime disability pension. Shortly afterwards my health became worse in every way. It became necessary for me to take sedative tablets twice a day. The doctor said that he would not be responsible if these pills were not taken. In spite of these tablets the nervous attacks became more frequent. At this point my wife, who had only a short time before become interested in Christian Science, asked me if I would care to visit a practitioner. My reply, given in desperation, was, "Yes, I will try anything." I shall never forget the love shown by the practitioner.
"In Isaiah we read (9:2), "The..."

He was permanently healed of the leg injury and shell shock (plus alcoholism) in a very short time

During my search, I came across this up-to-date article, written by a retired Army chaplain, who spent more than 12 years with paratrooper and special operations units. He writes about how soldiers can find freedom from what this condition is termed today – "Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder”.

These days I find myself telling soldiers, especially those serving in Iraq and Afghanistan, that the events around them while in combat cannot inflict lasting damage on their lives, and will never be as life-changing as their relationship to God. His love for each of His sons and daughters—whether in uniform or not—defines that relationship. Prayer can turn wartime experiences into events that deepen character without hurting, wounding, or destroying anyone spiritually or mentally.
“Post-combat healing"

Love and peace,

Judy

Yes, thanks Nahmeed

There were hundreds of reports from both sides - there was also, at the end of the war, another sighting that was named, "The White Cavalry" but I'll get to that one later! Yes, stress and extreme fatigue can make someone hallucinate, but would a hallucination cause a moral reformation and redemption? What I find sad is the way that these accounts have been largely excluded from military history.

Love and peace,

Judy

I joined the british army in 1984 as a Battlefield Medic and went to Northern Ireland and Bosnia when the problems were going on and you would be surprised even then what things were left out the M.O.D. use the blanket of security to omite information.
Shell shock or as it known by PTSD has changed with the type of warfare we fight.The WW1 symptons as i understand it was mainly from being shelled and been on edge constantly as you knew following this the enemy would be attacking.
There seems to be a difference to enlisted men and profesional soldiers. From my experience the trauma can manifest itself in what you see also.In my case i saw the aftermath of a firefight.What i found hard was that as a british army medic i was bound by the Geneve convention and a non-combatant even in firefights but if the otherside did not then the first order of targets by the other side were Medic, Officer then Radio operater.
Being under that pressure,which is nothing compared to a frontline infantryman up front and face to face may cause moral reformation or redemption and may have been left out of military history.If a soldier went to his Officer and said such a thing he would be dismissed and ridiculed and if he refused to fight on be punished as a deserter and perhaps shot or hung dependant how much ammunition was available.
As you know i am an atheist and it was the two places i went to that made me realise the depths people would go to for religion or ethnicity.There may have been such redemption or reformation but it would have been a private thing and have been able to be practised more after the war or conflict even upon leaving the forces.
My daughter who is 24 years old and went to Military schools was told about the angel of Mons and also[ which i am going to research} about the battle of Ypres

Hi Nahmeed,

Thanks for your interesting post. I'm impressed that a military school would teach the kids about the Angels of Mons - things are looking up!

Did you read the testimony on post 3 (the middle one) of the ambulance driver at the Somme? Just thought you would appreciate it, considering what you were doing. There will always be stuff that you have to keep silent about - frustrating. My Dad was on some secret island in the Indian Ocean during WW2 (he was in intelligence) and he would never tell us where it was, just kept mentioning the Official Secrets Act and he took that secret to his grave.

I have no idea about Bosnia, but I've always thought that "religion" was a lame excuse for N Ireland. To me, if either side had actually had any idea of what true religion is, they would have known that they were totally going against it (just like what is happening in the Middle East now) To me, I see it as a tribal war, not a religious one. I'm not surprised that you are an atheist - if I was expected to believe in the warped concept of God that some people do, I would be one too! 😉

Funny that you wrote on this thread again as I've just come back from Dorset, which included a trip to the Bovington tank museum for my husband. I couldn't bear the sight of all those killing machines, though it was largely due to their production that the enemy was defeated and the 4 long years of trench warfare during WW1 were finally over. The museum had built some trenches for their WW1 exhibition, which were very interesting and made this thread more meaningful. There was a rocking back-and-forth model of a shell-shocked soldier, moaning. It was very distressing.

I had no idea that the German trenches were built to last. Their tunnels were equipped with heating, telephone connections, electricity, beds and a pipe to pump out water and some had wallpaper! They were lined with wooden paneling and wooden flooring and seemed much more "comfortable" than the British ones which were pretty basic, mud lined with sandbags. This below is a sad page, but the photos give a good idea of what the German trenches were like, especially the very bottom one on the left:

And this will give you an idea of a British trench:

If you’re squeamish, don’t read this one!

Actually, all the descriptions of the vermin that made the soldiers' life hell, reminded me of this testimony below. (It's worth reading it online as he was almost killed and lost his hearing because of a huge bomb, but found healing.)

In common with the rest of the soldiers I soon found myself very verminous because of the almost total lack of washing facilities and having to sleep in dirty barns and the like. I knew that all things are possible to God, and after using my knowledge of Christian Science on this problem, I gradually became cleaner, until one day I was quite free from these pests, despite the fact that I still had on my old dirty clothes and was living under the same conditions. From that time, until leaving France, I was quite free from this trouble.
Edwin Albert Garner, Moseley, Birmingham, England.

The other thing I didn't realise is that there were always more than just one row of trenches. There was the one at the front, facing the enemy, then another behind for the reserves, then another for stores and another for sleeping and eating. There were thousands of miles of trenches and they had to have road names as the troops were always getting lost! The men did not stay in the trenches for very long - only a few days, with probably not more than 24 hours at the front and they kept rotating the men and then they would be sent away for rest and recuperation, so it wasn't as brutal as I'd always imagined.

Then yesterday I went to a special WW1 commemorative concert at the WIndsor Battalion church, with music and poetry, which was very moving, especially the letter written by a 21 year old soldier to his father and sisters two days before his death. He knew he was going to go "over the top" and that he probably wouldn't survive. He said he wasn't afraid of death but hoped that they would all stay cheerful. There wasn't a dry eye in the building.

Love and peace,

Judy

I agree that religion is often the excuse for war rather than the reason. But saying, "if either side had actually any idea of what true religion is ..." Is simply joining in with that attitude of " I know and you don't. "
To dismiss war as "tribal" is to ignore all the politics and history of not only the region where the killing takes place but also of the world.
From Pope Urban to ISIS reasons for "religious" war goes far deeper than who believes what. It's equally possible to dismiss (although I wouldn't) WW1 as a "family spat".

Hi Crowan,

Glad you're still reading this - I wouldn't have thought it was your cup of tea at all! 😉

The reason I said that if either side had an idea of what true religion is, is that love is at the centre of all true religion. (note that I said TRUE religion, because obviously many fall short.)

What do we get when we break the word "religion" into its Latin roots?

• The Latin "re," when used as a prefix, means "again" or "to go back."

• "Lig" means to "tie," "connect," or "bind."

• And the suffix "ion" means "the act of," "state of," or "result of the act of."

Put these together and the word "religion" in its purest, most idealized form, means to be in a state of "connecting again" - the act of or state of "Reconnection."

So really, the word "religion" means our connection to all that IS. We are all one and I pray that one day our global consciousness will rise enough to understand this and that love will be the motivation in everything we do and then harmony will reign. Love and peace,

Judy

Hi Nahmeed,

Thanks for your interesting post. I'm impressed that a military school would teach the kids about the Angels of Mons - things are looking up!

Did you read the testimony on post 3 (the middle one) of the ambulance driver at the Somme? Just thought you would appreciate it, considering what you were doing. There will always be stuff that you have to keep silent about - frustrating. My Dad was on some secret island in the Indian Ocean during WW2 (he was in intelligence) and he would never tell us where it was, just kept mentioning the Official Secrets Act and he took that secret to his grave.

I have no idea about Bosnia, but I've always thought that "religion" was a lame excuse for N Ireland. To me, if either side had actually had any idea of what true religion is, they would have known that they were totally going against it (just like what is happening in the Middle East now) To me, I see it as a tribal war, not a religious one. I'm not surprised that you are an atheist - if I was expected to believe in the warped concept of God that some people do, I would be one too! 😉

Funny that you wrote on this thread again as I've just come back from Dorset, which included a trip to the Bovington tank museum for my husband. I couldn't bear the sight of all those killing machines, though it was largely due to their production that the enemy was defeated and the 4 long years of trench warfare during WW1 were finally over. The museum had built some trenches for their WW1 exhibition, which were very interesting and made this thread more meaningful. There was a rocking back-and-forth model of a shell-shocked soldier, moaning. It was very distressing.

I had no idea that the German trenches were built to last. Their tunnels were equipped with heating, telephone connections, electricity, beds and a pipe to pump out water and some had wallpaper! They were lined with wooden paneling and wooden flooring and seemed much more "comfortable" than the British ones which were pretty basic, mud lined with sandbags. This below is a sad page, but the photos give a good idea of what the German trenches were like, especially the very bottom one on the left:

And this will give you an idea of a British trench:

If you’re squeamish, don’t read this one!

Actually, all the descriptions of the vermin that made the soldiers' life hell, reminded me of this testimony below. (It's worth reading it online as he was almost killed and lost his hearing because of a huge bomb, but found healing.)

The other thing I didn't realise is that there were always more than just one row of trenches. There was the one at the front, facing the enemy, then another behind for the reserves, then another for stores and another for sleeping and eating. There were thousands of miles of trenches and they had to have road names as the troops were always getting lost! The men did not stay in the trenches for very long - only a few days, with probably not more than 24 hours at the front and they kept rotating the men and then they would be sent away for rest and recuperation, so it wasn't as brutal as I'd always imagined.

Then yesterday I went to a special WW1 commemorative concert at the WIndsor Battalion church, with music and poetry, which was very moving, especially the letter written by a 21 year old soldier to his father and sisters two days before his death. He knew he was going to go "over the top" and that he probably wouldn't survive. He said he wasn't afraid of death but hoped that they would all stay cheerful. There wasn't a dry eye in the building.

Love and peace,

Judy

Hi Judy.
Thanks for your reply.
I always find rememberance day emotional i have my own memories. What makes it happier is that i go to the church service with the scouts i am a cub scout leader so it wouldn,t be nice for them to see ( Baloo) my pack name to be upset. I don,t know if you know that some packs name there leaders after Junglebook characters.
When they play last post it is always moving. The service is always happier than some denominations.The minister knows about my Buddhist beliefs.
I agree about the killing machines every time there,s a conflict the ways the human race seem to find to murder each other is disturbing.
I had a thought about the angel sighting.Remember i said about the days of getting shelled in there trenches was normaly a pre-cursor to a attack by the foot soldiers.
This would normaly happen at first light.Both sides would send up flares to find out what was happening.These flares as they still are were made of White Phosporous when they hit the ground in that light could appear to be something which they are not to soldiers under that amount of stress.
I think whatever your beliefs if some soldiers regardless of colour creed or nationality gained any amount of comfort from the Angel of Mons sightings then it can be only a good thing.
Take care.
Martin.

I had a thought about the angel sighting.Remember i said about the days of getting shelled in there trenches was normaly a pre-cursor to a attack by the foot soldiers.
This would normaly happen at first light.Both sides would send up flares to find out what was happening.These flares as they still are were made of White Phosporous when they hit the ground in that light could appear to be something which they are not to soldiers under that amount of stress.
I think whatever your beliefs if some soldiers regardless of colour creed or nationality gained any amount of comfort from the Angel of Mons sightings then it can be only a good thing.
Take care.
Martin.

Hello Baloo! 😉

Yes indeed, it was a good thing! The visions of the Angels of Mons stopped the German army from sweeping through Belgium and France and taking probably the whole of Europe over. It gave the Allies time to retreat and dig trenches (this was the first battle of WW1)

There have been many attempts by the authorities to discredit what the men said, but hundreds of them (on both sides) reported (not to their officers, but to nurses in the hospitals and later to their families) seeing these sights. I don't think (I may be wrong) that there were any trenches to attack during the early days of that battle.

Also, it doesn't explain how those who saw the visions not only gathered new courage and also inspired their comrades to face fearlessly the issues of the hour and to escape what seemed deadly peril; neither does it explain how many of the men were conscious of a moral transformation beginning at that very hour they saw the visions.

On the first page of this thread I put a video which included a woman talking about her father's memory and these too:

"An employee of the author's grandfather was totally convinced that he had seen the angel; and although before the war he was known as a man over-fond of hard-drink, after Mons he became not only teetotal but a pillar of the community, apparently for no other reason that what he claimed to have experienced on the retreat." (Philip J Haythornthwaite, The World War One Source Book 1992)

Even the Western Front Association admit on their website:

“If the self-professed numbers of eyewitnesses are to be believed - and even recently centenarian ex-Great War soldiers were seen on television still telling their stories of personally seeing the Angel of Mons - these events certainly happened…”

(they go on to explain that it was probably mass hysteria)

...I can not say without a doubt that angels appeared that day....I wasn't there. However, I heard the eye-witness account of my Uncle Billy, and I can say without a doubt that he believed absolutely that he saw Saint Michael the Archangel there at Mons, and that St Michael had everything to do with their survival." From: Irish soldiers and the Angel of Mons

"I believe 'The Angels of Mons' to be a true event. Some 28 years ago I worked very briefly in an old peoples home for three weeks, aged 21. During this time I helped care for a lovely dear gentleman, around 80 years old. On my last shift I went to say goodbye to him. He took hold of my hand and looked at me with such an intensity and told me of his story of The Angels of Mons, a story which I have never forgot.
'I was there and I saw them. They came down and saved us. Don't ever let anyone tell you it didn't happen because I saw them they saved us. Don't you forget this story and you tell them I saw them, they saved us.'
He was so intense and genuinely pleading, that I should remember this story. I know he was telling the truth."

Historians have been arguing about this for 100 years so we're not going to sort it out! :p

Love and peace,

Judy

I was on You Tube a couple of days ago, reading an article when something in the comments caught my eye. Some one had added their comments and also told of an American company, regiment or such called the 91st, who saw action in France during WW I. They got this name because their commanding officer got them to read the 91st Psalm daily. The writer went on to talk of an engagement where other American troops had losses but this 91st lot had non.
I have no idea if this is true but it certainly made me think.

Hi again Scomm,

I've resurrected this story for a reason. Do you remember I did a bit of digging and came up with this:

F. L. Rawson, was a noted engineer and one of England's great scientists. He relates to the story of a British regiment under the command of a Colonel Whittlesey, which served in World War I for more than four years without losing a man....

On doing more research, through Ancestry, first of all, I couldn't find a Colonel Whittlesey in either the British or US armies during WW1. I then discovered that the Rawson mentioned above had originally been a student of Christian Science (so much for wanting testimonies from other denominations or religions!)

Anyway, the reason I'm writing now (from the CS Reading Room where I work) is because it was quiet due to the rain and I picked up a book all about the relief work instigated by our Mother Church in Boston, USA, during WW1. I came across this account and wonder whether it might have been the source of the probably more exaggerated ones that we both found. It concerned a Christian Science Chaplain, Arthur C. Whitney (did his name eventually become Whittlesey through illegible handwriting?)

He was sent to the Army School near Langres, France, and then (wait for it) to the 91st Division, which saw active service in Belgium, assisting the British, French and Belgium armies, under the command of the King of Belgium. Mercifully I have discovered that I don't need to copy, word for word the account from the Captain of his regiment, about the great assistance to morale that Chaplain Whitney provided as it was reproduced in the CS periodicals, but with his name left out. You can read the letter from the commanding officer from the link below, but this was included in it and I wonder whether that could have been the source of what appears to be a rather exaggerated myth:

The chaplain stayed with me throughout the engagement in the front line, and I am glad to say, my company did not suffer a single casualty;

Extracts from Letters"

And here is the 91st Division's own report of the Battle of Lys-Scheldte:

It was good to note in the book "Christian Science Wartime Activities" that Marshall Petain, Commander-in Chief of the French Armies issued the following citation:

Chaplain Arthur C. Whitney, 346 Regiment infantry near Waereghem, Belgium, October 31st 1918, placed himself at the head of the company and marched with it to the reserved positions. By his courageous works and his coolness he aided in keeping good order among this troop"

and "The official record of the regiment mentions the incident as 'one of the most deadly shellings which the regiment sustained'. For this service the French Government awarded Chaplain Whitney the Croix de Guerre with bronze star."

I have further learnt that a divisional unit in the United States Army typically consists of 17,000 to 21,000 soldiers commanded by a major general and then broken down into smaller units. (The three artillery regiments of the 91st Division were the 346th, 347th and 348th)

So hopefully I have cleared up the mysterious story about the 91st Division who all survived by praying with the 91st Psalm every day. Clearly not true, but there were elements of it in one or more battles of its 346th unit. As to whether Chaplain Whitney asked all the men to study the 91st Psalm - it doesn't say! :p

Love and peace,

Judy

Just felt that I wanted to include these wonderful BBC photos of the poppies at the Tower of London.

I went at the beginning of the week and it is truly moving. I'm going to place the poppy I bought on the grave of my father's cousin who was wounded during the battle of the Somme in 1916 and died of his wounds 4 days later, so it made it feel especially poignant to know that one of the 888,246 poppies represented a member of my family.

I've been watching the very moving BBC tribute at 7 pm each day, which ended tonight, called"The Passing Bells". I liked the way the writer had included the stories of both sides and it was so beautiful the way that Tommy (the British soldier) found beauty and comfort in the birds that carried on singing in all that horror, ugliness and brutality. It reminded me of this beautiful article titled
[url]The Lesson of the Nightingales[/url] It was written about how the birds in the woods lifted the heart of the author during the First World War. Here's an excerpt.

It was noticed that there were a few inhabitants of the wood who took little or no notice of the shrieking shells and the crashing timber, a few who refused to allow anything to hinder their outpouring of praise. The nightingales never ceased their songs; and, as if defying the claim of evil, they poured forth glorious volumes of joy, apparently oblivious to the strife around them, as if to remind all who heard the melody of the Psalmist's words, "He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty."

The writer has often wondered whether those sweet-throated songsters were in any way cognizant of the evil sights and sound around them. Certainly they taught him a great lesson; namely, that evil is wholly unknown to the consciousness consecrated to God, good.

When she was young, my sister knew the author of this piece and he told her that once, he and his men were surrounded and it seemed impossible to get out. He told his men he needed some quiet time and went into the woods to pray and that's when he saw the nightingales (which is probably what prompted this article) A way out became clear to him and he and his men all escaped.

Love and peace,

Judy

I'm afraid I have some real reservations about the Tower of London poppies - surely the time has come to remember ALL the dead, not just those from the UK.
Although, that would have taken up quite a bit of Greater London.

I'm afraid I have some real reservations about the Tower of London poppies - surely the time has come to remember ALL the dead, not just those from the UK.
Although, that would have taken up quite a bit of Greater London.

I should have known I could count on you Crowan for a negative remark! :rolleyes:

Crowan, it isn't just the UK dead, but all the Commonwealth [Colonial] deaths as well - from Australia, New Zealand, Canada, India, (which included Pakistan in those days) plus many African countries and I'm sure others I don't know about.

I've just done an edit to add this item about the 400,000 Muslim soldiers who fought alongside British troops.

And yes, you are right, there is no way that everyone who died in this war could possibly be commemorated by a poppy at the Tower. I posted this earlier:

The total number (from all countries) of [url]military and civilian casualties in WW1[/url] was over 37 million. (the mind boggles) There were over 16 million deaths and 20 million wounded ranking it among the deadliest conflicts in human history.

I'm sure that all other countries (those that were considered friends or foes in those days) are remembering this centenary in their own ways, after all they all have their own memorials in their own countries. There are also memorials to the horses killed. They were also heroes - albeit unwitting ones, taking the 19th C mounted war into the war machines of the 20th C to face slaughter.

But I for one am very grateful that we are remembering and that this enormous sacrifice of each of those men (and their families) and of course, all the wounded and shell-shocked hasn't just been relegated to the forgotten past. No matter how you may think of the politics behind what happened, those men deserve our respect and gratitude.

Love and peace,

Judy

Crowan, it isn't just the UK dead, but all the Commonwealth deaths as well - from Australia, New Zealand, Canada, India, (which included Pakistan in those days) plus many African countries and I'm sure others I don't know about.

Check your facts. The installation at the Tower has one poppy for each of the British soldiers killed. And that’s it. The Commonwealth soldiers are not included. Nurses are not included. Allies, civilians, “enemies”, the Chinese Labour Corps, are not included.
I seem to have pushed a button here. I am simply stating my position which is that I have reservations about, and will not join in, any remembrance that is partisan. I have been practicing shamanism for nearly thirty years and all my experiences have led me to this position: There is no separation.
I accept that your views are different. I know that Mary Baker Eddy wrote, in 1898,
“ I will say I can see no other way of settling difficulties between individuals and nations than by means of their wholesome tribunals, equitable laws, and sound, well-kept treaties. . . . But if our nation's rights or honor were seized, every citizen would be a soldier and woman would be armed with power girt for the hour.”

Hi Crowan,

Strange, the Tower website agrees with you, but I got my info from the media and from The [url]Royal British Legion[/url]

888,246 poppies have been installed, one for each British and Colonial fatality during the war.

Where I have made a mistake was using the word "Commonwealth" There was no such thing 100 years ago. Great Britain consisted of the UK and its colonies, which was the largest empire in the world. The British Empire So when they say just "British" that term included the colonies in 1918

Your quote was from an article Mary Baker Eddy wrote for the Boston Herald, in March, 1898. This was the beginning:

Other Ways than by War
In reply to your question, “Should difficulties between the United States and Spain be settled peacefully by statesmanship and diplomacy, in a way honorable and satisfactory to both nations?” I will say I can see no other way of settling difficulties between individuals and nations than by means of their wholesome tribunals, equitable laws, and sound, well-kept treaties.

A bullet in a man’s heart never settles the question of his life. The mental animus goes on, and urges that the answer to the sublime question as to man’s life shall come from God and that its adjustment shall be according to His laws. The characters and lives of men determine the peace, prosperity, and life of nations. Killing men is not consonant with the higher law whereby wrong and injustice are righted and exterminated.

And from another article for the Boston Globe, December, 1904

How Strife may be Stilled

Nothing is gained by fighting, but much is lost.

Peace is the promise and reward of rightness. Governments have no right to engraft into civilization the burlesque of uncivil economics. War is in itself an evil, barbarous, devilish. Victory in error is defeat in Truth. War is not in the domain of good; war weakens power and must finally fall, pierced by its own sword.

The Principle of all power is God, and God is Love. Whatever brings into human thought or action an element opposed to Love, is never requisite, never a necessity, and is not sanctioned by the law of God, the law of Love. The Founder of Christianity said: “My peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you.”

Christian Science reinforces Christ’s sayings and doings. The Principle of Christian Science demonstrates peace. Christianity is the chain of scientific being reappearing in all ages, maintaining its obvious correspondence with the Scriptures and uniting all periods in the design of God. The First Commandment in the Hebrew Decalogue — “Thou shalt have no other gods before me” — obeyed, is sufficient to still all strife. God is the divine Mind. Hence the sequence: Had all peoples one Mind, peace would reign.

God is Father, infinite, and this great truth, when understood in its divine metaphysics, will establish the brotherhood of man, end wars, and demonstrate “on earth peace, good will toward men.”

I have simply stated my reasons for having reservations about the Tower of London installation. These are matters of principle for me – I would have thought, judging from previous things you have written (and from your username) that you could understand such a thing. And also understand that, when examining our principles over particular issues like this one, not everyone is going to come down in the same place.

Strange, the Tower website agrees with you, but I got my info from the media and from The [url]Royal British Legion[/url]

Yes, there seems to be a lot of confusion over the numbers. What is certain is that it does not include civilians or “enemies”. Therefore my ‘matter of principle’ stands. As far as your Mary Baker Eddy quotations are concerned, I would have thought that brought your thinking closer to mine, not further away.

Yet I have clearly (as I said before) pushed buttons. You said:

I should have known I could count on you Crowan for a negative remark!

Could you explain to me what you think I have said that is so negative?
You also said:

But I for one am very grateful that we are remembering and that this enormous sacrifice of each of those men (and their families) and of course, all the wounded and shell-shocked hasn't just been relegated to the forgotten past. No matter how you may think of the politics behind what happened, those men deserve our respect and gratitude.

Again, you seem to be reading into my post more than I said. What is it you think you have to persuade me of?

Dear Crowan, I started this as an inspirational thread, to shine a tiny bit of light and gratitude onto a terrible terrible war, filled with untold suffering. War is always evil. Sometimes it's the lesser of two evils. While standing up to the Nazis was a very clear-cut choice between good and evil, I don't think anyone (especially those poor lads who went through it) really is sure why the First World War started or what it was all about.

While the world is remembering and recounting all the horror of that terrible war, I was so grateful to be reminded of the Angels of Mons - a phenomena that, despite all the attempts of cynical people to discredit it, has survived, with the men who saw the sights going to their graves insisting that they saw angels and that those angels saved their lives.

I then searched the Christian Science testimonies from WW1 and was so grateful to find, that, through faith, a few men were able to come through the same terrible experiences that either killed, maimed or permanently disabled others, physically and mentally. I really had hoped to find some from other religions or philosophies, from men who were at the front (and would have been delighted to read any special experiences of nurses etc in the field hospitals - and any civilians who came through danger through prayer). The fact is, that I couldn't find any. I even wrote to a Jewish museum to ask if they had any. I can't believe there aren't others - it's probably that the CS Church has kept records (which are now searchable online) over the past 130 years.

I don't know if you're read all the testimonies I've posted but I find it so inspiring that anyone could find freedom from fear, peace and protection right in the middle of bombardments, extreme danger and sheer terror. It's only by feeling the presence of divine Love, Spirit, that we can reach a spiritual consciousness that can be untouched by what is going on materially all around. I was inspired by the way the men (of all nationalities, including the two beautiful German testimonies I posted) had no desire to harm anyone and in many cases said how they were able to come right through the war without firing a shot or hurting anyone at all. I'm also grateful for how they included all their men in their prayers and the protection that the whole group experienced was felt and acknowledged.

I found some of the testimonies in a book titled, "A Century of Christian Science Healing" and just before they begin the war testimonies, on p 73, they write:

"A Christian Scientist facing a great calamity in which hundreds, thousands, or even millions of lives may be lost does not think that the saving power of divine Love is especially directed toward him. He is convinced, however, that the law of God properly understood and practiced vanquishes every evil circumstance that may present itself, and that this law must be demonstrated individually though it is available universally." (my highlights)

The fact that these few men have demonstrated these laws proves that they are available for all, regardless of religion (or none).

I'm sorry you found my mentioning the poppies at the Tower somehow objectionable, but when I see any honest and heartfelt commemoration of the losses and suffering in WWI (or any other conflict), I'm just grateful that people care enough to make sure those who lost their lives in war aren't forgotten.

I can't be getting into politics, national or gender-related and I'm not interested in arguing with you. I don't know why you insinuate that my principles are any different from Mary Baker Eddy's (or any decent person's for that matter). This really saddens me. I'm not trying to glorify war. War is disgusting. It is evil. I'm giving gratitude for experiences of protection and healing that took place right in the middle of all that horror.

No-one is pointing a gun at your head Crowan and forcing you to come to the Christianity pages or to read what I post. A few days ago, you wrote this to someone who was challenging you on the Shamanism forums:

I have to wonder why you started this discussion. There are many forums about different beliefs on HP and I disagree with the basic concepts of several of them. If these came up in general discussion then I might say something. I would not, however, go on to (for example) the Christianity forum and explain that the Christians are wrong to worship their god. I wonder, therefore, why you have decided to call into question a basic part of shamanic belief in this particular place?

A universal concept Crowan, is the Golden Rule, the Christian version being, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

Love and peace,

Judy

Since you are determined to misunderstand - to the extent of accusing me of saying the opposite of what I did say - me, I see no point in continuing. All I have really taken from this exchange is that you cannot bear to be disagreed with. That is a shame.

Today we commemorate the end of the First World War. The guns finally stopped at the 11th hour on the 11th day of the 11th month in 1918 and since then all who have so unselfishly served their country have been remembered.

I felt it was fitting to give thanks today for the chaplains who served at the front. They were not fighting men and were totally unprepared for what they were to face, but they helped lift morale, silence fear and to comfort. 168 chaplains lost their lives during WW1. I have already spoken about one chaplain, Chaplain Arthur C. Whitney with the 91st Division in post 45 above, who I suspect might have been the source of the myth of the whole division coming through unscathed through praying with the 91st Psalm each day, but a friend sent me this link to a BBC article and it's really worth reading:

[url]WW1 chaplains It's written by BBC Health Editor Hugh Pym about his grandfather, Tom Pym[/url]

Tom and his fellow chaplains were totally unprepared for what they were about to experience. It transformed how they saw their role during war. They went from holding services far from the battlefield, to risking their lives on or near the front line - 168 chaplains lost their lives during the course of the war.
Their actions not only changed the way that Army commanders and ordinary soldiers thought about them, it also defined a new role for chaplains in the British Army.

The horrors of the Western Front were hard to stomach for many chaplains. Tom faced his greatest test when he had to stay up all night, ministering to a young man sentenced to be shot at dawn for desertion.

That's the part of that terrible war that I'm sure all of us find most inhumane and unforgiveable. Those men were not cowards, they were mentally just shot to pieces. Shudder.

When I re-read the letter about Chaplain Whitney today from his commanding officer, I was delighted to find Armistice Day mentioned, so I will re-post a bit of it:

"I deem it my duty and still a great pleasure to write regarding the splendid work of the Christian Scientist chaplain assigned to our division. He was attached to our regiment just before the battle of the Lys-Scheldte, and went into action with my company voluntarily. It is such an unusual sight to see a chaplain with front line troops that his presence caused considerable favorable comment among the officers and men of the company. The chaplain marched with me at the head of my company through heavy shell fire when we marched into position for the attack. His calm and encouraging remarks helped materially to steady the men, and, I am frank to say, caused me to feel a security and confidence that I have never felt under fire before.

“…the chaplain suggested that I repeat the following to myself: 'God is my guide, God is my strength, God is my protection.' I followed his advice, and when the situation seemed particularly difficult found a great deal of peace and security in those simple phrases. I soon began to understand that God's law was operating, and it dawned on me that His presence on the battle field was as certain as the moonlight which lighted our way.

And a later bit:

"Later I was ordered to take my company across the Scheldte and relieve a certain French organization to our front. The chaplain insisted on being with the company, even thought I told him how dangerous our task was. We passed through the French first line and, with the company deployed as skirmishers over a seven hundred yard front, advanced to a village eight hundred yards beyond. We took this village under heavy machine gun and shell fire and drove out fifty of the enemy machine gunners. The chaplain stayed with me throughout the engagement in the front line, and I am glad to say, my company did not suffer a single casualty; divine Providence guided us safely to our position and we received word that any further advance would be postponed. The following morning as we were forming for the attack, we received information that the armistice had been signed.”
"Extracts from Letters"

From the BBC article above, this seems typical of those brave men:

The chaplain insisted on being with the company, even thought I told him how dangerous our task was.

And where I think the myth might have originated from:

The chaplain stayed with me throughout the engagement in the front line, and I am glad to say, my company did not suffer a single casualty; divine Providence guided us safely to our position and we received word that any further advance would be postponed.

And then:

The following morning as we were forming for the attack, we received information that the armistice had been signed.

Once can't even imagine the relief for everyone concerned, on both sides, at the front, at home and in the hospitals.

Love and peace,

Judy

This children's video was made for the Remembrance commemorations and was shown on remembrance Sunday at 11 am and also today, Armistice Day. It's very sensitive:

There are only 6 days left on iPlayer

And it's also interesting to see the thought that went into its production:

As it's Christmas, it seems the right time to include the "Christmas Miracle" of 100 years ago.

Those who have been following this may like to know:
Christmas Truce which will be broadcast on Radio 2 on Christmas Eve 2014 at 10pm. All Is Calm - The Story of the Christmas Truce will be narrated by John Hurt

Here are some snippets from soldier's letters:

"Altogether we had a great day with our enemies, and parted with much hand-shaking and mutual goodwill." Percy Jones of the Queen's Westminster Regiment.
"It was a curious scene - a lovely moonlit (Christmas) night, the German trenches with small lights on them, and the men on both sides gathered in groups on the parapets. It is weird to think that tomorrow night we shall be at it again. If one gets through this show it will be a Christmas time to live in one's memory." Captain R Armes of the 1st North Staffordshire regiment.
"It was absolutely astounding, and if I had seen it on a cinematograph film I should have sworn that it was faked." Lieutenant Sir Edward Hulse, 2nd Scots Guards.
"What a sight; little groups of Germans and British extending along the length of our front. Out of the darkness we could hear the laughter and see lighted matches. Where they couldn't talk the language, they made themselves understood by signs, and everyone seemed to be getting on nicely. Here we were laughing and chatting to men whom only a few hours before we were trying to kill " Corporal John Ferguson of the Seaforth Highlanders.

Here is some interesting historical information from a website that's got quite comprehensive coverage of the 1914 Christmas truce.

ON some parts of the Western Front there was no truce. At others the truce 'failed'. This letter suggests there was more chance of a truce where Saxons made up the German line than if Prussians were in the enemy trenches:
"The following are extracts from a letter of a Leicestershire soldier at the front dated January 2nd: 'We had a rather sad occurrence on Christmas Day. Directly in front of our regiment there were one or two German regiments. On our right was a regiment of Prussian Guards and on our left a Saxon Regiment. On Christmas morning some of our fellows shouted across to them saying that if they would not fire our chaps would meet them halfway between the trenches and spend Christmas Day as friends. They consented to do so. Our chaps at once went out and when in the open the Prussians fired on them, killing two and wounding many more. The Saxons, who behaved like gentlemen, threatened the Prussians if they did the same trick again.Well during Christmas Day our fellows and the Saxons fixed up a table between the two trenches and they spent a happy time together and exchanged souvenirs and presented one another with little keepsakes. They said they would not fire on us as they considered us all English gentlemen and all the while we were opposed to one another they never bothered us at all. They said they did not want war and thought the Kaiser quite in the wrong. They were continually falling out with the Prussians.

And if any of you feel distinctly uncomfortable about the Sainsbury's Christmas football match ad like I do, this correspondent from Germany sums it up for me:

Viewpoint: Christmas is not for trivialising war
I am at a loss to explain to my German readers how the foremost lobby group for service personnel in Britain could have approved of a supermarket's attempt to enlist the story of brave, indeed heroic soldiers for the profane task of selling more turkeys and puddings.

What we get, is a sanitised, terribly sentimental version of what happened in a number of places along the Western front: British, French and German soldiers decided to give World War One a break. Initially they were fulfilling a grim task - to bury their comrades whose bodies had been lying in no man's land, some for weeks or months. But then the gesture of respect for each other's dead developed into something more. For a day or two, in some places even well into the New Year, the men in uniform sang carols, met between the trenches, exchanged gifts and even played football. One source actually reports a match result - it was 3-2 to Germany, apparently.

I hope everyone here had a peaceful Christmas!

This will be my last post on the Christmas Truce. A friend sent me this today and I thought it was so interesting that I've included it here.

This is an amazing fact that I only learned today - the Christmas Truce has been wiped out of French history. This article I link to below is written by a Frenchman . He knew absolutely nothing about the Christmas Truce of 1914 and when he found out and started researching it, he came up against huge opposition.

It shows me how the Angels of Mons were also written out of the history books too.
Here are some excerpts from it:

[url]How France has forgotten the Christmas truce soldiers[/url]
In 1992, I learned from Yves Buffetaut's book, Battles of Flanders and Artois, that enemy soldiers on opposing sides fraternised with each other over the Christmas period of 1914. I read that some French soldiers applauded a Bavarian tenor, their enemy a German, on Christmas Eve while others played football with the Germans the next day.

Joint burials also took place in no man's land with Masses read in Latin. Soldiers visited each others' trenches to compare working conditions. Some evenings when the Scotch whisky had been flowing, soldiers fell asleep in the opposite trench and left the following day, apologising to those who "lived" there.


I neither wanted nor was able to believe any of that. This was so contrary to the war I had learnt about at school, full of suffering, selflessness, and courage in the face of the enemy.

I met with the author of the book to ask him for evidence. He took me to the Imperial War Museum in London and showed me British soldiers' letters, sketches and photos - yes photos. They show smiling faces, comrades standing arm-in-arm and a real sense of joie de vivre. I felt the tears welling up. What a shock.
I rounded off my research in the World War One German Army archives in the Bibliotheque de Documentation Internationale Contemporaine (BDIC) in Nanterre

I remember a note written by German soldiers which reached the French trench and was reported by a Second Bureau officer.

This message, written in rudimentary French, warned French soldiers that a colonel was due to visit their trench and they would have to open fire at about 2pm. So it would be a good idea to duck at about that time. However, it would definitely not prevent them from having a drink as planned at 5pm. It was signed: "Your fond German comrades.


Germany must be given back a memory which belongs to it.

The documents I consulted expressed the same desire to meet up, sing songs on Christmas Eve and swap addresses with the intention of meeting after the war.

One of these men left us an extraordinary account of the spirit of this fraternisation. His name is Louis Barthas, a cooper in Aude departement before the war and a corporal during the four years of the conflict, which he survived.


Barthas wrote: "Shared suffering brings hearts together, dissolves hatred and prompts sympathy among indifferent people and even enemies. Those who deny this understand nothing of human psychology. French and German soldiers looked at one another and saw that they were all equal as men."

He went on to make a wish from the depths of his trench near Arras: "Maybe one day in this part of Artois region, they will erect a monument to commemorate this surge of brotherly feeling among men who hated war and who were forced to kill each other against their will."

Love and peace,

Judy

The 12th October 2015 was the centenary of Edith Cavell's execution. This brave woman reached out to unconditionally help soldiers from both sides and assisted some 200 Allied soldiers to escape from German-occupied Belgium.

Her last words were:

• Standing as I do in view of God and eternity, I realise that patriotism is not enough.

I must have no hatred or bitterness towards anyone.
Edith Louisa Cavell, October 11th 1915

If you want to read about her life, this is one of the good sites:

Love and peace,

Judy

She was an incredibly brave woman. I am glad this anniversary has been publicised so well.