The Gospel of Judas - New Find

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

WoW!!!
I'm gonna gohave a peek mate.... I've always maintained that he had to be 'in on it' if you get what I mean, just as Pilate's actions would have to have been pre-ordaned - for it to fall into place as it did at the right time...So how responsible can he be held[sm=scratchchin.gif]

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Hi Chaps,

I'm glad you posted this Venetian, because it was last week's Christian Science Monitor and I was going to write about it, but then all the euphoria of Jill Carroll's release (who we had been praying for) was announced, and I clean forgot about it!

I've always felt it was Judas' destiny to betray Jesus. It was all part of prophecy and he was simply fulfilling that. The fact that he literally couldn't live with what he had done shows that he was not a bad person. He simply had to do what he had to do.

Well, that's my story and I'm sticking to it!

Judy

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Thankyou Venetian for bringing this to us. This is just so facinating and Im really interested in the Gnostic texts. Ive been studying the Pistis Sophia alongside The Keys of Enoch and in one of the study sessions the other day we were shown how Judas didnt betray Jesus as Jesus knew all about it.

Warm regards

Aurora

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Hi Aurora,

I find Pistis Sophia and all texts related to Enoch just fascinating.

ORIGINAL: Conspiritualist

I've always maintained that he had to be 'in on it' if you get what I mean,

Was it Judas or Caesar who cried out, "Infamy! Infamy! They've all got it in fer me!" ? Oh - Kenneth Williams as Caesar I now recall.

Anyway, not so often a new gospel is discovered, what?

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

This is fascinating synchronicity as it was just this afternoon that I was told that the only person that Judas betrayed was himself, he betrayed his own soul due to his own lack of self love due to self-hatred that was unhealed. So in effect he sold himself down the river of emotion.....and as such did not become his Christ self; and with suicide they come straight back to do it all again. So one could say betraying one's own soul is really carnal and not spiritual.

I wonder another allegory?

I don't buy the story......about Jesus wishing to die because he spoke and spent his own 'life' preserving life.

As he said 'God is in the living not the dead'.

Divine Love

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

For the record, my own view on all I know about the gospel (what's in the link)....

I only posted it as the discovery of an unread gospel is news in itself and so rare now. But the gospel probably originates from the later gnostics. Contrary to popular public opinion, "gnosticism" is not one group (commonly perceived as 'more enlightened') but a whole varied blend of beliefs and some are pretty wild and silly.

We'll have to read the gospel when it comes out, but if it's claiming that Jesus simply wanted to escape the flesh body, that's typical of some forms of gnosticism (which were against everything physical, thinking matter to be 'evil'), and in that case the gospel will indeed be a kind of 'heresy'. I agree with Roger that Judas probably knew a lot more than we're told, but he certainly wasn't just an assistant to Jesus committing a form of suicide. It may be that he was an assist in getting the crucifixion to occur, because that was planned from the start, to fulfill Scripture about the Messiah. If they'd all refused to crucify him [&:]we wouldn't have Christianity today or the Western world as it is today! So someone had to make sure it happened....

We really need the Tardis to figure it out.

V

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Absolutely fascinating - thanks for that Venetian

Best wishes
Publisher [sm=wave.gif]

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

That's an excellent point Venetian and many of the Gnostics believed that 'The Kingdom of God is within' and if that is so then they would not wish to destroy the temple of the Spirit of God would they?

Also most believed that the story of Christ was allegory of the rites of passage in initiation, moving from 'being to becoming' the bride of the beloved and from experience once the bride of Christ comes together with the beloved e.g. the soul and the spirit come and merge together in divine union.
Hey bingo! We have hit the bullseye and broken the wheel of karma and the cycle of rebirth.

This is why many Gnostics were called heretics and why the orthodox did not understand or appreciate the layers of inner spiritual meanings of the truth they held in their hands. There is nothing like the Tree of Life experience it is the supreme text of knowledge.

The same is found although described differently in every world religion; when we dig deeply to below the roots, it is amazing what comes to the surface into the light of day.

Thank you for sharing I am always interested in new discoveries.

Blessings in abundance

Divine Love

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Well Venetian, looks like this is very topical indeed, a friend just brought the newspaper home and there you go a double page spread on this subject in the Daily Mail today.

Divine Love

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

and more a new book release 'the Jesus Papers'

Surviving the crucifixion would certainly tie up with islamic sciptures and gnostic texts.

Divine Love

TV Tonight 9pm - The Gospel of Judas

:)Soz it's a little late notice, but I see that it's on tonight @9m for those that get the 'National Geographic' Channel -
So Sat, Cable and maybe Digibox viewers... I dunno?
Looking forward to it... but hope they don't just wreck it like the always seem to - with lots of meaningless background music and prelim commentary eh!

RE: TV Tonight 9pm - The Gospel of Judas

I just get terrestrial, Roger. I wonder if you'd drop a couple of lines here in review? That'd be great.

V

RE: TV Tonight 9pm - The Gospel of Judas

Ha ha it includes teachings of reincarnation

Divine Love

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

This link lists some books on the subject for anyone who is interested.

Divine Love

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

This was sent to me today.....to view the full paper see the link

The Gospel Of Judas,
Barbelo & Long-Kept Secrets
By Mary Sparrowdancer
6-7-6

The truth usually surfaces sooner or later regardless of how carefully concealed it is.* One of the most stunning truths imaginable has been hidden so well for the last 2000 years that we have not caught a glimpse of its light until the recently surfaced Gospel of Judas.* This gospel suggests, among other things, that all generations of people have sat in judgment of Judas based simply on information given to the masses by the most powerful church on earth.* In reading this newly surfaced Gospel, and then reading Bishop Irenaeus' scathing rejection of it in 180 A.D., as well as his scathing rejection of all gnostic teachings (personal knowing of the divine), one wonders if this is the tip of the most unfathomable iceberg that ever was.* What else has been kept hidden from us by those in control of church and state?* Were we told the truth about the identity of Jesus - or was his identity reinvented?* If his identity was reinvented, then it appears that humanity's spiritual identity was reinvented as well.*

The primary shock and awe caused by the Gospel of Judas has been in the Gospel's suggestion that Jesus asked Judas to betray him.* It appears, however, that this Gospel contains hints of something else far more profound - so profound, in fact, that the implications are staggering, but they seem to have escaped notice thus far.* It hints of something extraordinary that has been hidden for thousands of years, although in existence since the beginning.*

In the "forbidden" gnostic gospels that have begun to emerge from antiquity, we find we have actually been divinely invited to seek the truth and ask questions, because the truth is never marred or harmed by questions.* Asking questions only serves to make the truth shine brighter.* One might wonder into which direction we should begin a search for the truth at this hour when the truth about anything is very hard to come by.* According to the gnostic gospels, the answer from above seems to have been, "go within," because there is something within that awaits discovery.*

In the gnostic scriptures, we learn that blind faith has never been demanded of us.* Instead, the one we now refer to as "Jesus" (the J is relatively new - it is Iesous in transliterated Greek) urged people to go within and seek the truth and not stop seeking until they found the truth.* Only a portion of this appears in the New Testament, but a more complete version can be read in the gnostic Gospel of Thomas.* It includes a curious caveat of wisdom after the invitation to come seek and find all that awaits us.* The caveat warns that when we discover the truth, we will at first be disturbed as well as astonished.*

In the end, however, it is the truth that will set us free.*

In looking at the Gospel of Judas (Ioudas) there are two words that are the keys to unlocking an extraordinary mystery.* The first key word is, "Barbelo," the word by which Judas identifies Jesus.* "I know who you are and where you have come from," Judas says.* "You are from the immortal realm of Barbelo."*

According to the scholars and editors who worked on the National Geographic translation of the Gospel of Judas, the word Barbelo "apparently comes from Hebrew," and perhaps means God.* Others state it remains unexplained, and some suggest it refers to a divine "emanation." **(1)

The second key word in the Gospel of Judas is, "betrayal," the word by which we now identify Judas.* In looking closely at this word, one finds that its meaning has changed over the centuries - something that is very common.* Many other words have changed in meaning as centuries separate us from the original writings.*

"Lucifer," for instance, a Latin word that means "light bringer," has now become equated with "satan" or the devil, despite the fact that Lucifer actually appears in the Latin Vulgate as a re

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Whew a lot there to reply to so may I just for once cop out?

All I can say is that the various new gospels found in the last 175 years, and even to this day, are wonderful and a great insight.

Imagine just being limited to the four, given what now is available??!!

V xxx

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Oh David, I think we have merely scraped the tip of a very large iceberg with these gospels,and I am quite certain that there are further 'lost gospels' to be found. The finding of the gospels, the Dead Sea Scrolls and references to Jesus in other texts, leave me in no doubt whatsoever that this person actually lived and moreover, that he was someone 'special.' I am yet unconvinced of his God-like status, but I am sure that he wasn't 'ordinary.'

I await further instalments......

Love,
Patsy.
😀

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

I hadn't been back to this thread for weeks as I've been away, but popped in as Patsy had just posted.

I found the excerpt from the book on the Gospel of Judas fascinating (thank you for that Kim) and it has prompted me to post again in my thread about the spiritual meaning of Genesis.

However, concerning the Talmud of Jmmanuel. Well, sorry, but I'm not convinced - it seems very strange if this were genuine that we haven't heard about it before. I also found the story of how two men just noticed a hole in the ground, found this document, didn't tell anyone about it. The one man who supposedly translated it had to flee his home in a war, leaving the original documents behind (??), after which they were destroyed. Then he and his family were assassinated. It all sounds like a subject for investigative journalism to me - perhaps a Channel 4 expose!

I find it more that a coincidence that this document supposedly affirms the existence of aliens, UFO's, many New Age beliefs, Jesus not being crucified or resurrected etc etc. I smell a hoax!

For the supposed history:

THE TALMUD OF JMMANUEL:
How this document, discovered in Jerusalem
in 1963, ushers in the New Age while exposing
the New Testament gospels as being more
corrupt than even the Jesus Seminar suspects

Tests for TJ genuineness areindirect because its original Aramaic scrolls were destroyed due to their heresies, and only the German translation survive (how convenient!)

I then found this site which, while obviously written from a fundie approach, does raise some questions that should be answered before we take this in, hook, line and sinker. There's a lot of money to be made these days from alternative views of Jesus - just look at the Da Vinci code etc.

[DLMURL] http://home.swipnet.se/corbie/Fuskwww/talmud.html [/DLMURL]

Love and peace,

Judy

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

ORIGINAL: Principled
I find it more that a coincidence that this document supposedly affirms the existence of aliens, UFO's, many New Age beliefs, Jesus not being crucified or resurrected etc etc. I smell a hoax!

I'm rusty on this thread and forget what's already written. If that's what the manuscript contains, I don't smell a hoax but see a clear one most visibly. 😀

RE: The Gospel of Judas - New Find

Hi Judy,

I agree with you, and with David. Any sort of 'lost gospel' that claims to 'usher in the New Age' smacks of hoaxing. I wouldn't believe a single word it uttered.

Love,
Patsy.
[8D]