Soul Retrieval. Learning

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi Wendy,

I was taught from early on (sorry!) to reject this idea of soul retrieval.

The concept is that parts of our soul are scattered or "lost", and by a ceremony of some kind you can "get them back". It happens that I disagree with that since the core of our being is One and is never lost.

As one teacher askedme after I had tried this, "Did you get retrieved?" I suddenly burst out laughing as I realised thatI did not, as nothing was lost in the first place! 😀

So I hope you do not mind my own perspective on this - I am just being honest and up-front about it.

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi again Wendy and all,

I should have explained, and did not - sorry! - that my reply above was not a direct one to your own post. I was actually writing about other concepts of "soul retrieval" which I find are flawed concepts. It's actually hard to explain as it would take so long to write it all out. In a nutshell, a spiritual group I was in touch with, and who numbered in the thousands, started getting into doing "soul retrieval" rituals on a regular basis, when they were in fact just normal people and had nothing to "retrieve"! So it was a rather silly exercise on their part. 😀

On the other hand, I do agree with your own post. I don't know whether we are dealing here with "bits of soul" or "multiple personalities" or other discarnates taking over a body, but it is certainly correct, yes, that in instances such as - say - child abuse (either violence or sexual) what seems to often happen is that the "real person" is ejected from the body (so as not to feel the pain, or even recall it), and someone or something else takes that body and goes through the experience. Whatever is actually happening, it's a protective way of dealing with the experience.

Possibly even some peple on HP have a mild form of this, and therefore a mental "black out" regarding parts of their past.

I certainly agree with your post on that, and if the violence is repetitive different "beings" take their turn to inhabit the body during the abusive episodes, yes.

In time what you end up with is the "real" owner of the body not recalling the abuse at all, and anything from two to a dozen other personalities who take over that person even years later and long after the abuse. This is well-documented. In worldly psychology they are called "multiple personalities" whereas for people like us who believe in the spirit world they can easily be seen as being other people i.e. discarnates. I always did believe this is what they were, but lately have read evidence that throws the whole subject open again for me.

Right now, to be honest, I'm not sure whether they are aspects of the actual person, or diferent (discarnate) people. I only know that it makes life difficult for such people, as, as you will know, you end up with a situation of several "persons" taking it in turns to inhabit a body from day to day, and one has no memory of the other. They may even keep a diary in order to talk to each other when each takes over the body. So it is a very hard way to live.

Love,

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

hello venetian, I only put this post up as some one ask me.
I dont follow all shaman way, I dont go after bit and peice of myself outside the bodyas I hold them within me.
I feel a person spirit is just coverd by an overcoat and sometimes the buttons get lost, but we can always search the pockets.
This is the web site the sould retrieval is from:D
love and blessings
lightwinds
Wendy x
PS I do injoy reading you thoughts V.

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi Wendy,

From memory an excellent and thought-provoking book on this which all my friends were into (and I chatted to the US author by phone) is "Remarkable Healings" by Dr. Shakuntala (?) Modi. I'm not sure what to make of it but she found multiple 'personalities' in many people via hypnosis. A very thorough book.

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi V, might have a look at the book, thanks.
love and many blessings
lightwinds
Wendy x

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi Venetian

From my personal experiences I would say that the inner child is not ejected but is buried very deep within us, some times it is buried so deep that it can take many years before it manages to start to make its presence known again.

Unfortunately it is not just the inner child that is locked up to protect it, we can also burry large chunks of our natural feeling in there at the same time which makes functioning on certain levels very difficult.

The good side is it teaches us at an early age to become detached which is vitalpart ofspiritual development, the bad side is to reconnect requires some painful healing and lots of changes in our lives which re-kicks the spiritual journey of with a big bang:-)

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi Paul,

Yes, certainly the inner child is not ejected as though in some exorcism, I agree.

In "Remarkable Healings" by Modi it's not at all clear this is what was coming up, however. Modi may find a whole string of, say, twenty personalities hidden in the unconscious which seemed to get released when brought out and spoken to. They'd gone into the 'soul' to take over in times of trauma. Psychologists will be certain these are elements of the unconscious; spiritualists will tend to say they are discarnates. I really didn't make my mind up TBH.

BTW any psychological construction such as Freud's, Jung's, and all the later ones and more recent ones about what "parts" our consciousness consists of are, most theorists on this now would say, just that - constructions. In other words they may have practical application in therapy,yet may not have a more concrete reality. For example Freud's various ideas about what "parts" the person has (and he changed his mind at least twice!) are clearly flawed, most would now say. Theory now has it that you can take almost any of these constructions and 'make them work'. What's important is actually just the talk therapy or etc. So the 'inner child' idea may work as a therapeutic method or construct, yet it's debatable if there actually is such a thing per se. (Just to get theoretical there!)

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi Venetian

From my experiences I can definitely say that if the circumstances are correct then yes the inner child which isour own innocent child consciousness can and will be buried deep to protect it, it is a natural survival tactic.

Under normal circumstances there would not be a need to do this so there would not be the inner child as it would have been able to develop normally along with the rest ofus. 🙂

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi VenetianFrom my personal experiences I would say that the inner child is not ejected but is buried very deep within us, some times it is buried so deep that it can take many years before it manages to start to make its presence known again.Unfortunately it is not just the inner child that is locked up to protect it, we can also burry large chunks of our natural feeling in there at the same time which makes functioning on certain levels very difficult.The good side is it teaches us at an early age to become detached which is vitalpart ofspiritual development, the bad side is to reconnect requires some painful healing and lots of changes in our lives which re-kicks the spiritual journey of with a big bang:-)

What you've written above Paul is very true to my own experiences. We dis-associate from experiences that are too painful or traumatic. When the time is right, we begin to piece together the lost parts of ourselves, that have remained hidden. The inner child knows what experiences it has been through, and it will gladly share those experiences with you. It is very painful healing where memories begin to surface and emotions come to the forefront, for acknowledgement and release.

What I am also finding is that whilst I am an adult, my inner child is asking to share information with me, she is demanding to be heard, and I am very aware that until I hear her out, I will continue to feel like a little girl. It's very strange, but she won't allow me to get on with my life, it's as if she's prompting me to do the work, to hear what she has to say and how she's feeling - I know that this is a very important step to my healing journey, and she holds key information that I have no recollection of in my normal waking state.

Love
Rosi x

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

ORIGINAL: Paul Crick

Under normal circumstances there would not be a need to do this so there would not be the inner child as it would have been able to develop normally along with the rest ofus. 🙂

That all makes sense to me. Also that it may not just be an 'inner child' - but also an inner 16-year-old, or from age 25, 30, etc.

Edit to add: But then what to make of therapeutic models that have it that we all have an inner child? Surely many people have a great upbringing without trauma?

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Edit to add: But then what to make of therapeutic models that have it that we all have an inner child? Surely many people have a great upbringing without trauma?

If you've had a happy upbringing without trauma, I would say that your inner child will be happy, and not cause a problem, so I believe we all have an inner child, its only when there has been trauma in childhood that the inner child will reflect that trauma.

Love
Rosi x

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

[sm=1syellow1.gif]That sounds about right. If you met me in real life (it's hard to tell over forums) you'd find my 'inner' child has never really been very inner! 😀

V

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

They could be mistaking the persons higher self with the inner child! One is spiritual whichpeople oftendon't believe in or understand and the other one is physical, saying that they are both found deep inside 🙂

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Very true David the inner child can flip out at any time and of course the inner child is part of the sub-conscious which is part of the soul. As a therapist that has used a soul retrievel method for many years now; I can assure you that the soul certainly can and does fragment, clinical psychologists call it 'dissociation' and are now researching what they call a medical disorder.

Carl Jung also talked about soul loss in this way.

Carl Jung said "For thousands of years rites of initiation have been teaching rebirth from the spirit, yet man has forgotten the meaning of divine intiatory procreation in our times. I simply believe that some part of the human self or soul is not subject to the laws of space and time. This forgetfulness causes him to suffer a loss of soul, a condition that sadly is everywhere present today. "Robert Francis Johnson, a psychotherapist, continues by saying, "This loss of Soul, Carl Jung speaks of is manifested in our culture by the crises we are all facing (increased drug abuse, violence, moral and emotional numbness).

Soul loss can be experienced due to severe trauma in childhood and later in life. E.g. bereavement, operations, car accidents, abuse, etc etc. Whenever one loses consciousness the soul starts to leave I even experienced this during a dental treatment. The soul is incredibly sensitive and much more fragile than people realise. For instance after an operation when a person does not come around it is because their soul has not got back into the body.

I agree with Lightwinds the soul also leaves the body of a night to do other things and is only connected to the physical by the silver cord in the golden bowl (e.g. Hara) as mentioned in the bible.

being love

Kim xx

PS Lightwinds we have had some excellent discussions on Soul Retrieval maybe you would consider providing one thread with all the links as a sticky.

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Anthropologists have traced this practice back 40,000 years.

"For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?" Jesus Christ

David you leave us with the impression that soul retrieval did not work for you; can you please enlighten us on the following:

1. What methods were used
2. How many fragments of the soul were collected
3. Were you aware of what the fragments were and why they flipped out?

I ask these questions because I have never met anyone that has experienced this therapy and not experienced profound results, mentally, emotionally and phyisically..

Many thanks

Kim xx

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi

Dissociation is now recognised by the medical profession. It is mentioned in DSM IV. There are five types of dissociation listed, the most extreme being dissociative identity disorder (DID), previously known as multiple personality disorder (MPD). If, as a therapist, you meet someone who is suffering from this condition, you need to think very carefullythat you feel confident, qualified, knowledgable, experienced, sorted and grounded enough to deal with it. Obviously, depending on the context of your relationship, be prepared for anything and you may be in it for the long haul. Therapy is generally required for at least 2 years, but usually 6+. DID is often caused by severe, prolonged and extreme childhood abuse of the satanic ritual abuse variety. Be prepared for the most horrific disclosures you will everhear so it is important to have good supervision/support in place. Be aware of the satanic calendar as there are significant dates for all survivors, though some may be personal (eg date of death). Be aware that triggers may have been implanted. Do not attempt hypnotherapy or soul retrieval as the sudden input of previously hidden memories can be catastrophic. This is a highy creative coping mechanism and to suggest that it is the result of 'discarnates' , in my view, denies the incredible ingenuity of the human organismto survive. If in doubt, be professional and refer on as you may be completely out of your depth. First Person Plural is a survivor-led group who can advise.

Regards
Tucker

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

ORIGINAL: Tucker

If, as a therapist, you meet someone who is suffering from this condition, you need to think very carefullythat you feel confident, qualified, knowledgable, experienced, sorted and grounded enough to deal with it.

On the whole, I'd say New Age people are not well-trained or grounded to do this. No serious qualifications.

Obviously, depending on the context of your relationship, be prepared for anything and you may be in it for the long haul. Therapy is generally required for at least 2 years, but usually 6+.

Sorry, but I totally disagree. :DThat's a spin put upon the idea of psychotherapy by Freudian-originated people who get their money from long-term clients. It doesn't pay them to treat someone in, say, six weeks. I like to keep posts impersonal and without personal questions, but may I ask if you are such a therapist, or a therapist of some form?

There's a lot of professional literature on this now, and it is well-documented,and that the need for a long-term haul in some cases is a myth (for there is no science behind it). Since the 60s there have been test-experiments where one group would have 2-4 years of "therapy" and another equal group would have nothing ... and both groups were equally healed, ergo the "therapy" of years' duration was a money-making illusion. In fact, there's contested evidence that the group which received no therapy healed better. This has been a major issue in the psychotherapy literature, and factually the idea that you need years of therapy was factually disproved. It makes one feel a bit sick, to think that even unconsciously money-making was the object.

DID is often caused by severe, prolonged and extreme childhood abuse of the satanic ritual abuse variety. Be prepared for the most horrific disclosures you will everhear

Did you get this from prolonged and repeated self-experience? Or from books and talking?

Christian fundies spread this urban myth around and it was disproved years ago. The very "councellors" behind the myth turned out to be C fundamentalists with a peculiar mindset. The notion that satanic abuse is very rife and prevalent was put down by factual evidence long ago. In fact, the parents involved were very, very hard-done by, and the people behind this myth have a lot to answer for.

Basically, the young children had been pointedly led to say what they said, by Christians with an agenda. Their arms were being twisted by the therapists. I think these so-called therapists, who infiltrated Social Services,have been put in their place now, at least in the UK.

Be aware that triggers may have been implanted.

Ouch, I don't know if you'll see eye to eye with others here since this sounds very fundie or very OTT and I have to say, in total peace, that I disagree - simply because I do, but also because this has no objective basis in the factual record.

This is a highy creative coping mechanism and to suggest that

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Moreover, IMHO the SOUL is one thing and is not ever fragmented.

If our real nature is that we are a part of God, and if we call this part of God "soul", then God is not ever hurt by anything - only the lesser psyche is. If by "soul" we mean the most fundamental part of ourselves, it is illogical IMO to consider that God can be fragmented. It is an old, and renewed ... superstition. And it puts some people in needless anxiety such as "Oh, I have 'lost' a part of myself" when, again, they have not and it is superstition - IMHO.

Perhaps the soul isn't harmed per se, but we can be cut off from feeling whole, and it is perhaps this feeling that something is 'missing' that we have termed 'losing a part of ourselves'.

As someone who has been split and who has disassociated from past experiences, I feel that I can speak on this subject. Venetian, traumatic experiences and memories that we have no waking access to, does indeed give the feeling that 'a part of yourself is missing' and missing it is because until you can recover the memories and deal with the pain, you will walk around feeling that something isn't quite right and that you are not whole.

It matters not what words you use to describe the feeling, I find that the words adequately describe what is going on at a much deeper level, and these feelings are very real.

I have definitely lost a part of myself, and am uncovering previous experiences that consciously I had no idea had occured, the feelings that go with this are very real, and to say one feels 'split' or 'has lost something' are just words to describe a feeling of loss, a feeling that something is amiss - unless you are experiencing this it is difficult to understand on a deep level.

I have lost a huge part of myself, the disassociation occured because they were too painful and traumatic for me to deal with, and I have always felt that something wasn't quite right - my feelings were correct all along, and now I am stronger to deal with what has been hidden from my conscious memory for all these years, and hidden it was for a reason, of that I am sure.

Love
Rosi x

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Dear Rosi1,

I am simply replying to you here and not as an expert. I doubt such a thing as an expert exists in these matters.

I agree with all you say. What separates people over issues is how they define words. Here, you are talking about a real, lived experience. I tend to say, "Hang on, what is actually meant by this term?" So I am tending to be more into the theory of it all. But to address real life:

I fully agree that if something is a trauma - typically in childhood, but maybe at any time of life - it can indeed get compartmentalised, so that it isn't part of conscious recall. There's not really any serious evidence against that. And yes, it may have to be dealt with. (Or does it? In some cases perhaps it can just be left to drift away - in some cases - and it does not have to be a great drama with so-called "experts" coming in and asking for cash to help out.)

It all comes down again to semantics or what we each mean by a word. Some therapy can be simply essential; on the other hand it can also be a con kept up even by the professional bodies. But if recalling blocked-out memories of the past - IF those memories are true and not kidded-in by a therapist with an agenda - can heal, then of course it is fully worthwhile.

My idea about therapy, having studied many different kinds, is simply that there may or may not be any reality behind the belief-system, but if it works, use it!

With Love,

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Idon't know if I have expressed myself well enough. I'll try, in short, again.

If the soul needs to be "retrieved" as it is broken into parts, then what is our concept of "soul"? Or, indeed, of Self???If our concept of our real, true, and inner Self is that we are God, then God is not prey to being arbitrarily "broken up". The God-Self within us is One. While parts of the psyche may be compartmentalised (not conscious, to avoid the pain), that is the psyche, not God, not the real self. Which is not to deny that healing is required - but there are many documented doubts about what works and what does not.

On the theoretical and highly questionablenotion that the soul is "broken into 'x' pieces", if we define 'Soul' as the real inner and unquenchable Reality of ourselves, then this is IMO a nonesense and a superstition -which has to get overturned. The Real Self is One, and always will be One. I think that people are kidded into thinking that their actual real selves - all that they are and could be - has been 'broken up'. Since we are, at core, aspects of God, this will never be possible, and nobody needs to worry that they have "lost" "parts" of themselves. One is One, and you are One.

Therapy can help. It is documented that the most helpful part of any therapy is not the system used or the method, but simply to talk to someone. It is as simple as that, and it does help. But the notion that, say, 30 percent of the self is "lost" somewhere else and has to be "found" - maybe by someone who gets paid for the assist ;)... nope. We are all Whole, and just have to realise and be it within ourselves.

I feel that this is a subject which could go around and around endlessly, because people mean different things when they use the word "soul". I'd ask one question: If you feel that you are capable of being "broken up" into pieces, and some pieces may be in Germany, and others on Mars, and others in the past, or whatever 😉

... then what concept of "Self" do you hold for yourself? Or what concept of yourself is a therapist throwing at you? I'd humbly suggest the retaining of a concept of Self as being One and incapable of fraction, for you are One since you are One with THE One, God. And then, in therapy, work around that core truth.

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hello Venetian

My point was only to post to alert people to the possible harm that they can do to their clients and/or themselves, when working in areas that are possibly beyond their competence. I have received training on DID from First Person Plural, the Trauma and Abuse Group and the Clinic for Dissociative Studies. I have worked with survivors of childhood sexual abuse for the past eight years; helplines, groups, one-to-ones, all mostly voluntarily.I have listened to hundreds of survivors. Each and everyone of them is different and each has their own path to healing. Iagree withyour point that long term counselling is often unnecessary but I was talking specifically about DID.

It is possible for memories to be implanted (in the same way that triggers can) and I cannot deny that unscrupulous, money-making, christian fundamentalist therapists exist but that is not my experience.

Regards
Tucker

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Hi Rosi

You may be interested in this site:

[link= http://www.jimhopper.com/memory ]www.jimhopper.com/memory[/link]

It's a round-up of the research on recovered memories.

Regards
Tucker

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

ORIGINAL: Tucker

My point was only to post to alert people to the possible harm that they can do to their clients and/or themselves, when working in areas that are possibly beyond their competence.

Yes, I agree, and there are people out there who don't have the kind of competance in training you refer to. How competant, after all, is a N.A. 'therapist' who as background would only, at most, say they were trained by another of the same?:eek:

On the subject of Christian fundies - not mainstream Christians - jumping on this bandwagon and then later being exposed within Social Services, that was simply a media story some time back, or rather the story was recounted in the media.

V xx

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

False Memory Syndrome - There were major fraud cases in the US by medical doctors for rich insurance pickings; whether they were Christian Fundalmentalists I have no idea.

Carl Jung dedicated his life to studying the soul/psyche and he also claimed “I simply believe that some part of the human self or soul is not subject to the laws of space and time. Suffering a loss of soul, a condition that sadly is everywhere present today.”. Clinical psychologists are now researching their theories about dissociation, they have named it Dissociate Identity Disorders (DID). Carl Jung believed that psychiatric theory took refuge behind alleged organic disorders of the brain to detract from the importance of soul consciousness. I agree with him why do the medical profession not turn to the experts of purifying consciousness? Shamans and healers have worked with dissociation for at least 40,000 years. Let us return the soul, bring home the consciousness and honour this ancient spiritual tradition of purifying the memories of emotional disharmony."

In my 15 years experience as a healer I view the soul as very different to the spirit. The soul retrieval therapist is only recording what the client experiences on their own journey to retrieve their fragments. They ask questions of the client but do not put responses in the way of the client. This is the clients experience but the therapist is on the journey with them to assist and to ensure they return all safely.

As far as the medical profession is concerned I provided this therapy to a renowned clinical psychologist who had worked with murderers and the like; she was so bowled over by her own experience she begged me to do a Phd at Edinburgh University on this and past life work.

I cringe every time a person says that a client needs 5 years, 2 years etc to heal themselves to be honest nothing could be further from the truth. The worst of abuse cases can be dealt with in about six months (with the right combination of methods and a positive willingness by the client to integrate) in my experience. All healers know that once we begin the purification journey it can be endlless; in joy as our being ascends more and more. One victim of abuse had been told she could never walk again and would need 5 years counselling; sadly the medical profession can do more harm than good. I honestly don't think that you can beat an experienced healer because they all work with healing and purifying the soul.

The police officer suffering from panic attacks was interesting and how he had left part of his soul at a car accident. Unless you have seriously tried this therapy as a client or practised it; you really do not have any reliable evidence to convey one way or the other.

If you accept that all is energy ask yourself why the energy system of the soul operates any differently from the cells in your body? Cells separate when they feel alienated from the rest of the community of the cells due to emotional trauma and feelings of alienation. The soul is the same it is energy that is very sensitive and can fragment, flip out into a different dimension.

My view is that the Spirit is the perfection of God and once the soul is fully purified it can then fully merge with the Spirit and once this is achieved one has broken the wheel of karma.

Being love

Kim xx

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

ORIGINAL: Sacredstar

Clinical psychologists are now researching their theories about dissociation, they have named it Dissociate Identity Disorders (DID).

Not quite. As I stated above, DID is the extreme end of a continuum of dissociative disorders. This includes depersonalisation disorder, dissociative amnesia, dissociative fugue etc. Have a look at theinformation that Mind have on their website: [link= http://www.mind.org.uk ]www.mind.org.uk[/link]
This will help to clarify your understanding of this very complex condition.

Regards
Tucker

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

ORIGINAL: Tucker

This includes depersonalisation disorder,

This is pretty much off-topic, but it reminds me of part of a thread somewhere, probably under Hinduism, where Sunanda and I were talking about a book written by a Western female guru or spiritual teacher. The book's title escapes me at the moment. But it was a peculiar tale. This lady suddenly found herself living her whole life 'looking at myself from outside, and not in myself as a personality'. She became so free of personality, so it seemed, that "students" began gathering around her and she became a 'spiritual teacher' for a short while, even writing this book. ("Collision With The Infinite" or something like that?)

In reading the book I felt a number of alarm bells going off. And it turned out that I had an updated, very recent version. My version had an addendum written by someone else, as the author had died soon after the book. After the book was written she started behaving very strangely, even went through 'normal' spells again, and died young of a brain tumour. In short, to any impartial observer, and even as the lady herself began to realise, the supposed 'Cosmic Consciousness' people thought she had was depersonalisation disorder as a result of the growth!

... a cautionary tale about how quick people are to follow someout who's out of the norm!

Venetian

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

There have been many different views on the soul from different philosophers down the ages. Here is a summary.

Current psychology believes all behavior is controlled by the central nervous system, e.g. it is sensible to study how the brain functions in order to understand behavior. This is the approach taken in behavioral neuroscience, cognitive neuroscience, and neuropsychology. Neuropsychology is the branch of psychology that aims to understand how the structure and function of the brain relate to specific psychological processes. Often neuropsychologists are employed as scientists to advance scientific or medical knowledge.

However, the soul holds memory of trauma in both this life and past lives, the soul holds a programme for the souls chosen evolution and this is not currently understood by science or mental health. I am in the process of developing a new website and I will be explaining more about this. So when we purify the soul we are purifying negative behavior/karmic patterns too. Ancient Egyptians used the phoenix rising from the ashes; this phoenix is the soul. The Egyptians also viewed the soul as different to the Spirit. During the evidence of our experience with past life work it has proven to us that there are karmic patterns of our lives and this can be the root cause of an endless repetitive cycle that traps people in unconscious behaviour patterns and this includes sexual abuse.

Another way of looking at it; when we redeem the divine feminine within we are actually redeeming the soul. How do we redeem the soul? By purifying it. The bible also defines the soul as different to the spirit and the body. One can also think of the soul and the spirit as the lover and the beloved.

Interesting that David mentions the word personality because Carl Jung often used the word personality when speaking of the soul. "Neither family nor society nor position can save man from his fate; nor yet the most successful adaptation to his environment, however smoothly he fits in. The development of personality (soul) is a favour that must be paid for dearly.
But the people who talk most loudly about developing their personalities (soul) are the very ones who are least mindful of the results, which are such as to frighten away weaker spirits. It also means fidelity to the law of one's own being. For the word "fidelity" I should prefer, in this context, the Greek used in the New Testement, which is erroneously translated "faith"". It literally means "trust", "trustful loyalty. Fidelity to the law of one's own being (Science of Being and the barometer of balance -v- imbalance) is a trust in this law, a loyal perseverance and confident hope; in short, an attitude such as a religious man should have towards God.” Carl Jung

Dear Tucker

Yes thank you, I have done some research to see what the medical profession are saying and you are probably aware of this link. This association confirm that there is very little information available specifically in the UK on Dissociation and Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID).

[DLMURL] http://www.dissociation.co.uk/home.htm [/DLMURL]
[DLMURL] http://www.dissociation.co.uk/research.htm [/DLMURL]

In my own research into mental health conditions I discovered that 80% of cases viewed had experienced ‘extreme loss’ in their lives and of course we do not teach children how to deal with change and loss. So loss in itself can be a cause of soul loss in my experience e.g. bereavement, redundancy, abortion etc.

I am sure you are aware the original meaning of the word ‘Psychology’ is actually study of the soul. Sadly, a majority of mental health professionals have not studied the soul. However, I am pleased to report that the Royal College of Psychiatrists are researching a new spiritual paradigm in medicine and this cannot be complete without purifying the soul.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

Checked out your link Tucker

ORIGINAL: Tucker

Have a look at the information that Mind have on their website:

This will help to clarify your understanding of this very complex condition.

Yes I already understand and things are not as complex as they might appear .

I am a great supporter of MIND and their superb work. I applaud them for stating 'probable' causes because in reality 'probability is as far as mental health goes (in the dark ages). In my experience one cannot get to the root cause of these serious core issues unless one considers the implications of the soul, and looks at the person as an individual case in their own multi-dimensionality.

The cosmos is multi-dimensional and so are we, as above, so below.

being love

Kim xx

RE: Soul Retrieval. Learning

"Soul" is a word.

So different people will mean quite different things, and so as often happens they can talk at cross-purposes due to semantics. For example, for some "soul" means the human or lesser self, not Higher Self. For others it's simply a poetic term e.g. Ray Charles: "I believe to my soul" (meaning deeply). A few others, by "soul" actually mean God Self or Higher Self.

I've found therefore that no useful dialogue can happen unless people give their definition; then you might actually find you have three different threads interesting three different groups.

As an example, IMO our Real Self is a perfect Higher Self, and all that doesn't equate with this perfection has to go someday, some life. I and others use the word "soul" to mean the imperfect (not the Perfect) memories of imperfect sights, happenings, thoughts etc which carry over from one life to another. By this definition, the soul itself is not the real self, and this "soul" has to be transmuted till it doesn't exist .. unless we forever desire imperfection. In other words, in the very long term, if we are God, the soul is impermanent. "I" am not my "soul" - by THIS definition. By this worldview we do indeed want the God Self, and to express this more and more, but the "soul" as imperfection never was intended to be and we don't want it. Best to put it into the flame of transmutation - it's not the real "us", it's maya, and we do in the end need to be rid of it. Key: it never was meant to be.

P.S. I can already anticipate that if this is read quickly there will be reaction: "I don't want to lose who I am!" or "You are in denial of the traumas" or such stuff. Again, note my definition of soul. And if someone wants to talk about soul as something different, that would need defining more clearly too. ("Soul" is not "psyche" as psyche is a broader term, so psychology is not soul-study, it's psyche-study.)

V