Native american indian sweat lodge

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hi Steve, Is the ceremony just a sweat lodge or a whole event?

I'm not too far from Farnham, and would be interested if it's a whole day.

Love and light
Rosi X

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hi Steve

Sounds like you are embarking on an adventure! I have been in many sweat lodges over the last 3 years. There is no one way to describe the experience, because even for one person each sweat lodge is different, and the same sweat lodge will provide different experiences to different people. For example, one person might experience the heat as overwhelmingly hot, whilst for another it is just right - how people deal with the heat indicates how aligned they are with the energy and my own experience shows me that if I am engaged in the sweat and not focussing on what my body is doing, then the sweat is easier than if I get stuck in telling myself: this is hot!!! This is a ceremonial space, so it's not like being in a sauna either!

And different people will run sweatlodges in different ways - so the best people to talk to about what will phyiscally happen are the people running the sweat (I would be surprised if they didn't run you through that on the day if this is your first sweat with them).

Be prepared for a new experience: be open to what may or may not happen and hold no expectations, just take the experience as it comes.

Blessings
Eagle

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

It's funny this thread has come up... I've just brought a book which mentions sweat lodges and it's the first time I've heard of it... so what is it?? 🙂

Thanks

Gail

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

one thing I need to do in a sweat lodge is be quite close to the door
in my very first one I innocently went inside and was opposite the door, and I could not handle that. I said so out loud and the woman leading it told me to come and sit by the door..just a little something to consider. of course, you may be totally at ease wherever you sit
enjoy this communion with the Earth
oh yes,if you are given black bags to put your clothes in beforehand, then tie a scarf around the top so you know where yours is after wards, and also it is fine to wear eg a swimsuit. I do
tigress

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hi, stevegreen.

Sweat Lodge ceremonies are good for body cleanliness as the heat and the steam can help the body to get rid of toxins. The ceremony mayalso used for 'spiritual purification', to intensify prayers, invocations and magical intention. Some people use them to prepare for difficult tasks or handle criese of sort.

Native American tribes all have diferent way as to the Sweat logde and it's meaning.
love and blessings
lightwinds x
Wendy

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

hi on a verry old post people were talking about having to pay to sweat .Thats odd to me.But things are different over there. I supose .All so in what form do you do lodge in the uk. is it Celtic lakota or to make things more simple isit aNative sweat or something diferent?

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

what i was told was if you get to hot .just put your head down and cover your self with your towel. that works the best.but in adition to that nuthing is or happens without discomfort,i was tought that we suffer so outhers may not and we struggle so we can grow like the seed when it is planted.not to mention the only thing we have is our blood are sweat and tears well thats what they say.the only thing that we have posestion of is our boddies.but for themost part relax your going home .

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Heya Hokeshela, welcome to HP! Do go introduce yourself if you haven't already.

Over here a sweat isn't done so much as part of a spiritual tradition, as with the First Nations, but more likely connected to a spiritual/awareness weekend. On the other hand, if you're lucky and get invited to a friend's gathering as I was some years back, then you might get to be part of a sweat! 😀

I can't really speak for what most people do over here but I think there are Native ones and more Celtic/Scandanavian ones, depending on who is running it.

The one I attended was mixed and we had to join in making the lodge (tarps over bent hazel branches) early in the day. There was a hole with heat-retaining rocks in the middle and we were smudged as we entered - naked. We also had to pass the scrutiny of a 'doorkeeper' who symbolically made sure we were doing it with the correct intent. A drummer drummed right through the night.

We had four rounds, with the heat building up each time of course and were dowsed with cold water in between. Anyone who was too hot could request to leave and we'd all shuffle round until they reached the door.

The four rounds entailed the initial detox, then prayers and personal offerings for others and the Earth, then focused intent and connection followed by release and celebration/prayers of thanks.

It was quite an experience and one I'd love to do again someday. As you say, the only thing we have possession of is our bodies and part of the discomfort is to offer that up and rise above and beyond it.

Blessings
Lorraine

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hello Hokeshela, Welcome to HP. I know when I went to see a Native American over here in Uk who teaches spirituailty called(Wa-Na-Nee-Che) lovely man. He gave some lovely talks and he call the Sweat Lodge," Earth Lodge". Never been to one myself.
love and blessings
lightwinds
Wendy x

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hm well i haven't done an intro. I was looking up sweat lodges on line ,because my brother and i talked about the fact that at one point most nations had them.So i was looking up sweat lodges in the UK. more or less and found this sight and thought this would be the best way to learn about how you do things now.in addition i can share how the lakota people do inepies or stone people lodges and or sweat lodges.I am a Lakota native (sioux) Plains indn. well to be more accurate im a mix but their are no full blooded indns left.That about it .
>Hokeshela

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

It's funny how we're guided, isn't it? 😉

in addition i can share how the lakota people do inepies or stone people lodges and or sweat lodges.I am a Lakota native (sioux) Plains indn. well to be more accurate im a mix but their are no full blooded indns left.That about it .

Please share what you feel comfortable with, Hokeshela. Over here the sweat tradition is gradually being re-discovered or maybe re-invented. I think more and more Europeans are trying to move away from copying the Lakota traditions and developing our own style.

Lorraine

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

my brother was telling me about a person that was singing celtic songs and doing lodge that way im not sure who she is we havent met her yet but she was yousing the lakota type of lodge 4 rounds same setup for the most part but like i sed everthing she did was in Gaelic not sure what forme being that that is a family of laguages.i dont see why you cant or even if its wrong to tke the form youse the form exactly but put it in your language like this person did ,and have the same basick form. from what i know all peoples had lodges in some form and i think that it is evry ones right to fined and get that back if they want it .for some reason all people lost that knowledge to some exctent perhaps we didnt youse it in the right way ,i dont know im just glad that some of that was not lost for me and that people all over are going back home
Hokeshela

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hello Hokeshela, Quote "People are going back home", back to one's traditional roots is a good thing for all people's of the world. I come from a place in Uk called Cornwall and we have our own language and it beginning to be revived again.The cornish language died out in late 18th century and was revived in 20th century There about 3,500 who speak Cornish for basic conversation and about 300-400 fluenty.
And soon it will be taught again in cornish schools. [sm=offtopic.gif] sorry was going off topic.
In Ireland I think it was 1970's they found little mounds that look like small sweat lodges.
Speak again soon I hope
love and blessings
lightwinds x
Wendy

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

Hi Hokeshela

I've been reading this thread with interest, and would love to hear more about the Lakota tradition of inepies or stone people lodges and sweat lodges. I have been going to regular sweat lodges in the UK for the last 3 years. These are based on Cherokee sweats and again consist of 4 rounds (welcoming in the powers and prayers for self, prayers for others, give away round and thanking the powers). Earlier you mentioned about charging for sweats. A charge is made at the sweats which are open to the general public, but this is not for the ceremony itself, this is to cover the costs of renting the place where the sweat takes place, the wood and refreshments. Noone is paid for organising or running the ceremony.

Blessings
Eagle

RE: Native american indian sweat lodge

I've just returned from a few days away after the sweat the lodge ceremony which took place on saturday. It was run by a man called Mike Chirobokow - Na’ To’ Win’ Niso (Sacred Warrior Coming Down) who is a pipe carrier and for over 20 years has lived, studied and learned amongst various North American Indian tribes primarily the Cree and the Blackfoot Indians. Connecting and working with the Blackfoot tribe he became the first non-native to become a Sundance leader.

The fee for the ceremony was £35 and the ceremony was, as has been decribed, with 4 rounds. It was a very beautiful and sometimes emotional ceremony, all who took part ( bar one person who felt unwell to start with) came out feeling rejuvenated and cleansed. I enjoy saunas but havre never sweated as much and the heat was not oppressive. It was thoroughly enjoyed and we have decided to do it again next month.

Steve

It is interesting to note that the Universe is duplicated in the Sweatlodge (called Initipi in Lakota language), according to the way I was taught, which may be different than what others have been taught.

As has been said many times before, variations exist not only between different tribes, but also there may be variations among different communities within the same tribe. You may find that how a Sweat is run on Pine Ridge is slightly different from how one is run on Rosebud or Standing Rock.

In the Lakota tradition, the dome-shaped framework of the willow saplings, with tanned buffalo robe coverings (or the blankets, quilts, or army canvas often used today), creates an environment that is in a sense, a microcosm of the Universe.

There is a perceived dome that is mirrored from the dome framework of the Sweatlodge above the surface of the earth, and extends below the surface of the earth, creating a spiritual sphere. The surface of the earth, upon which the participants sit inside, is in effect, the equator of this sphere in a same sense that the surface of the earth is also the mid-point between the dome shape of the sky, (from horizon to horizon, in a 360 degree circumference) with a perceived dome of equal size beneath the surface of the earth.

Inside the Sweatlodge or Initipi, there is a pit dug into the earth, and spherical shaped heated rocks are piled into the pit in such a way as to be in a mass half below and half above the surface of the earth, creating a sphere of heated rock. It is believed by some, that when the covering is closed, at that point in time and at that place, it is the center of the Universe.

Heated rocks in the shape of a sphere, in a pit that creates a mass of rocks in the shape of a sphere, in the center of a spherical Sweatlodge framework, which is in the center of the Universe seen from earth as a sphere.

In other levels of meaning in Lakota tradition, the willow framework of the Sweatlodge represent bones or specifically the ribs of a buffalo, and the outer covering (originally buffalo robes), represented the fur, skin and symbolic flesh of the buffalo. When participants crawl into the Sweatlodge, it is thought that they are symbolically entering the dark womb of a female buffalo, a symbol of the Universe in a very abstract sense, only to re-emerge from it after the ceremony ends, as if being born again, with a purified body and purified spirit.

The Inipi needs to be hot enough to make you sweat and hot enough to make you "uncomfortable" and "humble", but not so hot that it becomes painful. It is not supposed to be an endurance test, though unfortunately I know some that run theirs like that. If the heat is so hot that it becomes painful, the participants are so focused on the pain, they cannot focus well on prayers.

As far as what takes place in the Inipi, I was also taught that what goes on in the sweat, stays there. The implied meaning behind this is three-fold.

The first layer of implied meaning is that there needs to be a sense of confidentiality with fellow participants. If people are going to open up and pour their hearts out, they are becoming very vulnerable and need to trust that what is said in the sweat remains confidential information. Otherwise, people will not feel comfortable in getting to a sincere, heartfelt, and humble frame of mind and it defeats the purpose for having a sweat.

Secondly, the sweat is designed to purify negativity. Both the physical toxins and negative things in your body that is purged out through your sweat and goes into the ground, where it can be filtered and dispersed. That is why the coverings should be taken off after each sweat so that those things can be dispersed by sun and rain. I have been to sweats that have had the coverings on so long that the grass has died and mold and fungus is beginning to grow on the framework, or they cover the ground in carpets...eeeww! yuk! (More on this in a moment.)

Anyway, the spiritual toxins and negativities are also purged from your spirit as well, such as anger, jealousy, resentment, bitterness, sadness, distress, etc., and are "left" in the sweatlodge. To discuss what took place inside may bring those things back, which defeats the purpose for having a sweat also.

The third layer of meaning has to do with sacred space. When certain spiritual topics are discussed openly in a casual, normal atmosphere, some have said that malevolent spirits can listen in on the conversation and as a result, can cause mischief, confusion or even harm to people. In a sacred space such as inside a sweatlodge, the space is prepared with sage, cedar, prayers, etc. and becomes a "controlled" environment where only positive, benevolent spirits exist in a disproportional amount to a normal atmosphere, without any malevolent spirits present. Therefore, this sacred space becomes a safe environment to talk about certain spiritual topics.

Not too long ago, I had someone ask me about the difference between having a sweatlodge covered all of the time, versus taking the coverings off after every sweatlodge ceremony. I thought some would be interested in what I was taught about this aspect.

For some people, the norm has become a covered lodge most of the time. Mostly because they consider it to be too much time and effort to have to take the covers off, dry them out, store them, then put them back on well enough to cover the lodge again, etc. It's more of a time management issue with some people I guess. Besides, if you take the covers off, then you also have to keep the inside grass cut, which is also a chore, since a weed-whacker does not fit within a sweatlodge framework very "conveniently."

However, if you think about why a sweatlodge ceremony is done, it is designed on one level to purify the body, mind, spirit, etc. and purge negativities in the physical manifestation of sweat, which goes into the ground. In the old days, the interior of a sweatlodge had fresh sage covering the ground to sit on. This was intended to help filter and break up spiritual and physical negativities before they went into the ground, and to prevent the negativities from clinging onto the people sitting on the ground. When a sweatlodge ceremony is over, the coverings are taken off to allow sun and rain to cleanse the "contaminated ground" and dissipate all the negativities so that it can be used fresh for another ceremony at a later date.

When you keep the coverings on a sweatlodge, the sun and rain do not have a chance to dissipate the negativities from the previous sweatlodge ceremony, so participants end up sitting on potentially contaminated ground. It would be like taking a bath in a bathtub full of dirty bathwater that someone else has already taken a bath in. The coverings, if left on the sweatlodge long enough, will not dry out properly and can then grow mold and mildew, develop bee and wasp nests, spiders, ants, etc. Not a healthy environment. It will also eventually kill the grass, because of the lack of sunlight, so participants end up sitting on bare dirt and getting muddy. Because of this, some sweatlodge owners have gone as far as putting down carpet remnants in the interior to sit on. This means that the negativities never have a chance to get broken up and dissipate in the earth, they just collect and linger in the carpet. I can't think of a more disgusting environment in which to supposedly cleanse and purify oneself.

I uncover my sweatlodge the day after every sweat I have. I dry out the coverings then fold them and store them for the next time and pile the used rocks around the edge of the fire pit. I leave it uncovered the rest of the time, and weed-whack the interior every time I mow the lawn (about every 10 days or so). I do not replace the coverings until the day I am going to have a sweat. This also gives me something to do in the 3 hours or so it takes to heat the rocks. This method is more labor intensive and time consuming, but I believe in doing it in the way I was taught. The easiest way is not always the best way.

I now have South Dakota prairie sage (Artemisia ludoviciana gnaphalodes), growing in my garden. Sometime I will have enough quantity of sage that I would like to have fresh sage covering the ground when I do a sweatlodge or Inipi ceremony. I may not have enough to use it every time, but at least some of the time, such as the sweats I have four times a year as we change from one season to another. This is the old way of doing it that I grew up with.

Lastly, some folks have asked me about the framework of the sweatlodge. The way I was taught, after leaving tobacco offerings and saying prayers of thanks to the trees for offering themselves to be used in such a way, willow saplings about 1 inch diameter at the base, are cut and the bark stripped off to make the framework. Traditionally, long thin strips of the bark are used to tie the crossed willows together, though sometimes bailing twine has been used instead.

There are two types of Lakota sweatlodge frames that I am aware of, with different uses and meanings. One type uses 12 support saplings, which makes a square with an X in the middle of the square at the top of the lodge, and has one horizontal rib going around the sides. The other, larger version uses 16 support saplings, which makes a shape in the form of an eight-pointed star at the top of the lodge, and has four horizontal ribs going around the sides.

Keep in mind that this is what I know of the Lakota tradition. There are many, many tribes that follow sweatlodge traditions, with many versions, variations and meanings. To illustrate these variations, consider that in the Lakota way of doing things, traditionally, the "spirit trail" or the "sacred path of life" is formed from dirt taken out of the stone pit, dug in the center of the sweatlodge to hold the stones, and extends from the stone pit, out the door, and connects with the sacred mound or altar, which is also made from the same dirt. (Note: It is said that the sacred mound or altar represents the vision-quest hill.) One should never cross over it, nor should anyone (except the fire keeper) cross between the sacred mound and the fire pit.

In Ojibwa or Anishinaabe sweatlodge traditions, often there is a straight line of cedar needles along the ground from the stone pit to the sacred mound that is not to be crossed, instead of a dirt path.

In Cheyenne sweatlodge traditions, often there is a shallow, straight trench that is dug, connecting the stone pit and the sacred mound.

For an interesting description of a Lakota style sweatlodge, I can recommend:

"The Lakota Ritual Of The Sweat Lodge", by Raymond A. Bucko, 1998, University of Nebraska Press, Lincoln, NE, ISBN 0-8032-1272-0.

I hope this helps.

Wico'sani :->

sweat lodge

Has anyone taken part in this ceremony here in the UK? What was it like and what can I expect? I am attending one on Saturday near Farnham Surrey and would love to hear of anyone elses experiences

Hi Steve, i have been very fortunate to have spent some considerable time with the Crow Tribe in Montana, i did several sweat lodges over period of time, some were before the sundances that i did , another was before my first vision quest and others were for purification an healing sweats... these ceremonies took place on Tribal lands and on private lands across the states but mainly in Montana . One of the sundances and sweats was at pryor Montana on crow Tribal Land. I danced with the sundance leader "Ehnamani" known as Scott Frazer.. who,s home i stayed at also in Bozeman Montana.
The sweat lodge as with all Native ceremonies are very Sacred and all have great honour and purpose in them. I cannot tell you what to expect from youre sweat lodge except to say the obvious , that it will be very hot and very emotional depending on how you connect with the moment and what it is within you.. one word of warning is that if you are being asked for money for this sacred moment , then it is not the sacred moment you think it is and i would stay away.. The Tribes frown very much on Ceremony being offered for money.. These things are given to the people from the great Spirit, who is he that shall ask for things in return that are given freely from the great spirit...I hope and pray that this moment is a good thing for you and that the great spirit touches you in a way that is good for youre soul as im sure he will. ... This could be the start of a new way of life for you... and lots of changes..
Aho.. Mitakeyu Hoyasin.. (all our relatives) we are all one..
On another note i am trying to find some one local to Hampshire in the uk who has a sweat lodge that i may be able to sweat in! as in my current accomodation i have no garden or land upon which to do this, i woiuld be extremely grateful for any connection or info to anyone that can assist me with this...

Hi Colin and welcome to Healthypages,

You may not have noticed, but Steve started this thread 7 years ago, and has already returned from his sweat lodge experience. 🙂

All Love and Reiki Hugs

doh!!!

well thanks for the info lol, i never thought to look at the date ..ha ha , well i hope he had a great experience !!.. i guess ill have to post a new request for some one about a sweat lodge then!! Thanks for the info and welcome... Take Care , colin . 🙂