Soya - Is it good for us?

I tried rice milk but I can't stand the taste of it. I've got used to the soy milk. Almond milk is quite nice though.

Hi there!

I do worry when I hear people giving up dairy and going the 'soya' route, as it can bring on a whole load of 'soya' related diseases at some point. Soya is now classed amongst the ten most allergenic foods to cause chronic desease. It can also be known as vegetable oil, hydrogenated vegetable oil, lecithin, hydrolised protein, E471, E472, E322, and Vitamin 'E'.

It is very mucous-forming and very cheap which is why it is in so many things. In my own experience it has been directly responsible for conditions such as:

Acne
Rhinitis
Chronic rhinitis
Sinus congestion
Eczema
Chronic eczema
Stomach and bowel conditions (phytic acid in the soya bean messes up the villi in the stomach)
Thyroid problems

There are probably a host of other conditions linked also, not to mention cancer. Organisations such as What Doctors Don't Tell You, Foresight (pre-conceptual care), Dr. Mercola (mercola.com), The Gerson Institute and others all condemn soya products.

I am happy to email anyone my information on soya, as I really feel so strongly that it is not doing you any favours. Goats milk, unlike cows milk, is not adulterated, or as allergenic as the cow, and has solved an awful lot of my patients problems, especially children.

Candlelight 🙂 🙂 x

I'm reading this thread with a lot of interest. I'm a vegetarian for a long time and soy milk, soy yoghurt and tofu are part of my meals for years. So far I have never suffered from soya side effects - or so I believe. I don't want do defend soya at all, the opposite is the case, as I have now become a bit scared and consider to cut it out.
But what is the chance that for instance the very praised rice milk or other alternatives have a downside as well?

OMG!!!!:eeeK::speechless-smiley-0:016::029:

Is there nothing we can eat any more?

Love
Sunanda xxx

Hi Moonflower and Sunanda!

An informative website to look at on soya is 'soyonlineservice.co.nz' which will tell you a thing or two! On one of the covers last year of 'What Doctors Don't Tell You' publication, there was a picture of a plate with tofu and a knife and fork. It said, 'Healthy Soy? Cancer On A Plate'

I am pleased that you are thinking about cutting it out. Where Rice Milk is concerned, I think it depends on what condition you may have. If you don't suffer any health problems, it is probably ok for you. I just remember once, having a 'colitis' patient who made considerable recovery after I saw him. On follow-up I decided to test him on short grain brown rice and he tested sensitive.

I recommended he gave up his rice milk to see if he improved any further.....and wow!!! the improvements after that were just staggering!!:)

I really do think it depends on the individual - myself, if I were to have milk, I would choose goats.

Sunanda - it does seem a bit like that doesn't it? haha! 🙂

Candlelight :)x

Sunanda - it does seem a bit like that doesn't it? haha!

It certainly does! No longer can we just not eat or drink things that we KNOW aren't good for us: chocolate, alcohol etc. But now we can't even have the things we thought were good for us. It's enough to make me go out and buy a donut!!!

Love
Sunanda x

It's enough to make me go out and buy a donut!!!

hahaha, enjoy it!
... have to reconsider my dinner now :confused:

I will join you both.....if you can find a donut that doesn't contain soya!! 😀 🙂

Candlelight x

I don't mean to make this a bit worse, but apart from the above names soya is also known as monosodium glutamate. Nowadays EFA supplements can call it d-alpha tocopherol, instead of vitamin 'E'. Also, it is in a lot of lipsticks and cosmetics. Monsanto, (the people behind the soya industry), must be very happy that their business is booming, but at our expense.

I did such a silly thing this morning. I decided to have a vitamin 'E' supplement that originally I had been told did not contain soya. (It said rapeseed oil) on the box. However, I noticed it said mixed tocopherols, so called the manufacturers again, and this time they told me it was soya!

I feel so.....yuk with the thought that that is in me now!!:(

Candlelight x

No offence but I think I'll do some more research on this, because I have to say that since drinking soya milk instead of cow's my eczema has almost gone, my skin is better and I don't feel as crap as I do when I eat dairy.

I don't think soya is known as MSG and Vitamin E - I would have thought those things may be derived from soya, correct me if I'm wrong though.

I'm not convinced that soya is really evil yet, maybe researching it will change my mind, but it seems un-conclusive right now.

Hi Sal,

Vitamin 'E' is usually derived from soya or wheatgerm, but I haven't found it to be derived from wheat for several years myself. These days it tends to more likely be soya. 'Known as' was just a quick term I used. MSG, I have read, is also derived from soya, but I will check that from other sources.

I am not sure whether you have read my above post about the other names soya can come under, but it also mentions a website address. I would definitely do some research and then make up your mind.

Candlelight:) x

Okay this negative soya business is starting to do my head in! I believe in moderate consumation it's not worse than other foods. I can start drinking rice milk instead and eat more quorn and tomorrow I will find threads about how bad all that stuff is. Times have changed, people have more choices of what to eat, the supermarkets are full of non-seasonal fruit and vegs which I believe are as bad as they come to us from far away and have been picked unripen and sprayed with all sorts of chemicals. We don't even know anymore which fruit and veg is in season. I used to look forward to the first strawberries or aspargus etc. but now I can buy them all through the year! The possibility of developing intolerances or even allergies to food has never been higher. These days, there is NOTHING anymore we can really eat with a good concience. And I rather die of eating tofu than eating meat.

I used to eat a lot of soya based products (milk, tofu) etc. until I read several bits of scientific research on the subject about 10 months ago. Basically, non-fermented soya products are now known to give rise to thryoid problems and protein absorption problems. It is better to consume fermented soya products (i.e. tempeh, natto and miso) as these do not give rise to the problems.

There is a HUGE amount of well-evidenced reseach available at this link on the website of Dr Mercola: . Dr Mercola has the most visited alternative health website on the net according to alexa.com which is one industry standard used for assessing these things. You can check that at this link: [DLMURL] http://www.alexa.com/browse?&CategoryID=169 [/DLMURL] . (Interestingly enough, Gary Craig's EFT website is 4th in that list.)

In one article Dr Mercola busts the myth about Oriental people eating lots of soya that was mentioned above. He also talks about other health problems from eating soy.

I like his approach - he doesn't scare monger, but empowers through knowledge what he considers is healthy. I can take or leave his views as he doesn't "badger" in his writing. I feel I've got useful knowledge of what I can eat if it is soy based.

I've now switched to drinking raw milk based on what I've read from Dr Mercola's website - got some from our local farmers' market today and it tastes really good. I don't seem to suffer from mild rhinitis that I used to get when drinking pasteurised cow's milk or soya milk.

I went to a seminar by Prof. Jane Plant, who wrote 'Your Life in Your Hands' amongst other books. As she is a scientist-albeit an earth scientist-and has had breast cancer, and looked into causes for it. Plant has worked a lot in China and noted that very few women died of breast cancer there. Also in China they don't drink milk, and consume a lot of soya. Soya has been used for centuries over there and yet they don't get anywhere near the same rates of breast cancer as we do here. In short, she said, organic soya is absolutely fine, which confirmed my own thoughts and experience of soya. Milk however, is a totally different story, as you may well know. The dairy industry is also pretty big. Check out who funds the scientists who do these anti-soya articles, most of them are funded. Jane Plant has no one telling or paying her what to write.

Soya is fine, so long as it's organic. Milk, however......

While they don't get breast cancer, I understand that other forms of cancers are worse thanks to soya.

Check out who funds the scientists who do these anti-soya articles, most of them are funded.

I've looked at who funds Dr Mercola and his site, and all my research points to him making his money through the products he sells on his site. Dr Mercola has amassed a lot of information on the harm that soya does. Further Dr Mercola isn't selling a direct alternative to soy on his website. He encourages his readers to drink raw milk, which involves supporting small independent local dairy farmers. The sale of raw milk is a highly legalised issue in both the States and the UK and it's only small holdings that can even offer it. As far as I can see, the anti-soy information I've relied on isn't funded by big dairies with big money. At the same time, Dr Mercola has made a distinction between fermented and unfermented - so he's not tarring all soy with the same brush. I'm not sure your argument follows through with all that I've read, Mercy.

I work with a local nutritional therapist to help some of my clients, and even she has heard strong evidence from different sources to mine that unfermented soy is harmful.

There is an interesting article about the history of soy use in Japan and China at this link: [DLMURL] http://www.soyonlineservice.co.nz/01history.htm [/DLMURL] . It looks back to the state of play in Asia about a hundred years ago. I don't think the information is a detailed enough account to explain all soy use from a hundred years ago, but it's a useful start at looking at historical records.

Stepping back a little, I wonder why we drink the breast milk of another animal? What was going through the first person's head when he/she took the udder of a cow, squeezed it and drank it, after seeing a calf suckling? (And did he/she wipe the udder first?) It is a bit weird that we put cow juice on our cereal or in our tea...

And then...

And if you think about it even more, it's only one step between drinking nice cold, ice cold milk and asking, "Bitty?"

:011:

"I'm not sure your argument follows through with all that I've read, Mercy"

Hi, Crystal. I recommend you read Jane Plant's book 'Your Life in Your Hands' if you want to get her argument against dairy. I spent a day with her at a seminar and was impressed by the peer reviewed research she cited, and that she wasn't running a business out of her findings. That she is a scientist, and that she has been free of cancer for 20 years, despite having had it 5 times, also says quite a lot. I don't know about Mercola, or his arguments. Milk is a powerful cocktail of hormones, hormones that are meant for calves or goat's if you drink goat milk. Not for humans. I've not drank much milk for years, having prefered soya (organic) and have not had any health problems with it. I daresay some people do have intolerance or even allergies to soya, it is among one of the big 8. I haven't though. I also don't eat cold tofu, having learnt it is better to heat it for eating. Whilst I used to have milk occasionally in tea when I was out, I have since stopped. The scientific research against it, is too great. I also am avoiding casein, whey, and lactose. I strongly recommend her book if you are interested in her evidence. It is compelling, or check her web sites, or even the customer reviews from her books. The book isn't just pro-soya and anti-milk by the way...I realise I might be giving that impression!

Just found this:
The anti-soy "madness" is fueled by the American Dairy Association and the Weston A. Price Foundation, through articles written by Sally Fallon and Mary Enig, Ph.D. Both organizations stand to lose the most money due to soy consumption. The ADA wants you to keep drinking lots of milk and consume dairy products. The Price Foundation wants you to eat more lard, beef fat, lamb fat, butter, and all the poultry fats. I agree that butter has health benefits (especially when compared to the plastic alternatives), and there are many who feel chicken and duck fat have health benefits too, along with chicken soup. Saturated fat consumption is a controversial area. Some studies have shown that saturated fat improves cardiovascular health, while other studies have shown it to be a health risk. Most of the world thinks coconut oil, because it is a saturated fat, is a health hazard, but some recent studies have found [url]coconut oil[/url] to be one of the healthiest of all oils. Public opinion is that saturated fats are loaded with cholesterol. While the entire cholesterol issue is suspect (over 50% of those who suffer cardiovascular events have low cholesterol), saturated fats from vegetable sources like coconut and palm do not contain cholesterol.

and in the same article:

With all due respect to [url]Dr. Joseph Mercola[/url], who is basing his information on writings by Sally Fallon and Mary Enig, Ph.D., and whose website provides a wealth of valuable information, the anti soy propaganda doesn't make sense to me. There is evidence that eating too much of any food can have negative consequences. If you search for articles by Bill Sardi, Dr. Suzanne Paxton, and John Robbins, you will read rebuttals to the many claims of Sally Fallon, as many of the references in her articles are not backed up by well designed human studies. One of the problems with the Internet is that anyone (including me) can write an article and before you know it, the world is reading it; with most believing it.

Jane Plant acknowledges that soya can cause thyroid problems and adds that caution, and says take Icelandic Kelp to supplement it.

Here's some more on Fallon and Enig:

Hmmmm-especially this, Fallon's own website:

Incidentally, the first two paragraphs came from this:

Thanks for continuing the discussion, Mercy, and for presenting the other side of the coin. I need to spend more time looking at the research on soy that Jane Plant has drawn together - it's hard making the time in the run up to Christmas!

A couple of things I noticed from the articles you've linked to is that there are conflicting accounts about whether eating soya gives rise to thyroid problems. The aviva.ca article indicates that this is another myth, whilst you note that this is a problem. Poor thyroid function in myself for no obvious reason was the first thing that made me look into my diet as to what was causing it. The only thing I could connect it to was drinking soya milk, and since coming off it I've found an improvement.

About the milk debate - is it really the big dairy companies that are benefiting, or smaller indpendent ones? Fallon's website is campaigning for raw milk from small dairies rather than processed milk from big industry methods. I'm surprised that the American Dairies Association would fund the Weston Price foundation or have any connection with it, when their members are unlikely to be the key beneficiaries of any move back to milk.

I gave up drinking cows milk 10 years ago as I could not 'stomach' eating produce coming from animals that are given growth hormones to increase their milk production and milked even if they have infections meaning that pus and blood at "accepted levels" went into my milk. At the time my research also indicated that pasteurised milk was not a healthgiving food. I've recently changed back to drinking raw unpasteurised milk because cows are given a high level of care - farmers can't afford to be milking an animal that has an infected udder because they will not be killing off any harmful bacteria through heating the milk. Secondly, from what I have read raw milk is beneficial to human health as it has more nutrients than ordinary milk.

There's an element of trust involved in the decisions we make about our eating choices as well as the research we read about and analyse. Just as you've found Jane Plant to be trustworthy in the information she provides about soya I've found Dr Mercola to be so. I don't agree with everything he writes about - you won't find me eating raw eggs or changing from being a vegetarian. However, what he has written about soya has resonated with me, especially as he's not suggesting a blanket ban of the food. At the same time I'm open to reading about other viewpoints and if sensible adjusting or even changing my views.

Just read through this interesting thread and would like to add my recent experience.
About a year ago I changed to soya milk for making my porridge each morning as I had read that it could help alleviate menopausal problems.At first it seemed to help but over the last year I have developed various ailments, aches and pains that I put down to my age. Things like carpal tunnel, plantar faciitis, panic attacks, itchy dry skin and so the list goes on.
During the last week or so I have had extreme fatigue, so extreme that I found it an effort to walk from one room to another. I had a look on HP for clues and lo and behold I find that virtually all my symptoms could be caused by an under active thyroid and that soya could be aggravating the problem.
Anyways, I decided then and there to stop the soya milk and start taking sea kelp tablets. That was two days ago and I noticed this morning that my head felt less foggy and I have much more energy.My limbs don't ache now and I don't feel the need to sleep constantly.
I also found on HP a mention about certain foods that interfere with thyroid functions so I am revising my diet and have gone back to skimmed organic cows milk for breakfast. I finally feel that I am seeing light at the end of the tunnel and am convinced that all the aches and pains I have suffered this lat year are not down to "My age" but my diet.

I love soya products especially tofu and soya milk.

heard on TV the other night that 25% of cows milk can be stuff like antibiotics etc that the cow has been taking? anyone hear of such a thing?

im not vegan just don't eat meat/fish but this drastically put me off cows milk and now drink soya milk - so please don't tell me this is not good either??
:confused:

Cows get mastitis like women and like women have antibiotics. The dairy industry allow some pus to get into the milk for human consumption as mastitis is very common among the poor cows and they are still milked as usual, which must be so painful for them.

Look up

Also to add. My friend has had soya milk for about 20 yrs and has had three haelthy kiddies who are growing up vegan .

Cows get mastitis like women and like women have antibiotics. The dairy industry allow some pus to get into the milk for human consumption as mastitis is very common among the poor cows and they are still milked as usual, which must be so painful for them.

Look up

Also to add. My friend has had soya milk for about 20 yrs and has had three haelthy kiddies who are growing up vegan .

pus gets in milk and blood too.poor cows.

Amethystfairy:(

thinking about this i breastfeed my two first for 9weeks with bottle and second one 11 months wiht bottle as well whne they stopped breastfeeding and i switched into givingthem milk in bottles they had lot of mucus from their noses and get bit wheezy so i made the decision to switch them into drinking soya milk and their noses became clean! i used to take them to nursery and seeing other infants with snot noses :eek:and mine with clean noses :027: knew it was the diary food although i carried on given them cows milk cheese as was afriad they would be low on calcium,i didnt know enough that time to get alternatives.but got them skimmed milk and half fat cheese instead for years.the second one is a vegan now!so i believe soya is ok have to get the right one though.my daughter knows i have forgotten what to avoid and sometimes come home with the wrong one d'oh!

Amethystfairy:):)

i've read also that after a certain age (whatever age a baby normally gets taken off a milk only diet - excuse my ignorance) the human body isn't designed to be able to digest milk - we are not meant to drink milk (animal's milk).

i've gone right off it lately. have been on soya milk this last few days but yet to try tea with it (i like it with everything else)

Look up
.

OMG i feel sick now....poor cows! I don't think i will ever touch dairy again. I didn't know about the calves and rennet 🙁

Properly fermented and prepared soya (about 99% of the products we have in this country) are not a problem. I stopped drinking cows milk 24 years ago due to medical problems caused by it.

However, because of the increasing popularity of eating healthy (as well as more people becoming vegetarian, many meat eaters will eat at least a couple of vegetarian meals per week), soya has become more popular in the western world. Popular = profit, so yes, rainforests are being cut down to grow soya which obviously has huge environmental implications. Although, the new bio-fuels are a bigger problem as they are far more profitable (that's a laugh isn't it, the new bio-fuels are coming in to reduce carbon emissions but at the expense of the rain forests that naturally fix the effects of carbon emissions!).

If you don't want to drink cows milk and are concerned about soya, there is another solution - fruit juice! This might sound gross to some people but this is what I did when I first stopped drinking cows milk - pour fruit juice on cereal, even a dash in coffee and see what it tastes like (I found apple juice was the best but now drink black coffee and normally use soya milk on cereal).