Why Do Bad Things Happen To Good People??

I know this is a rubbish answer and not very philosophical but I doubt whether there's anyone who thinks life is "fair". Various peope will think diffferent things. Some poeple think life is random, others believe it is pre-determined, others believe we have to learn lessons from our hardships etc etc.

I agree that it seems unfair that people who are good and young can die. To me life is full of "unfairness" if you look more closely. Why are some people born with more opportunities than others, why are some born more academically/artistically/practically gifted than others, why are some born into loving happy supportive families and others not, why do some have more serious and debilitating health problems than others, why are some people born into more money than others, why are some people born into war- torn/poor/dangerous/restrictive countries or cultures and others not, why can't some loving people have children and abusers/paedophiles can ? The list just goes on and on.

I don't know the answer to this. I guess there are loads of different reasons as to why someone good may die early - from genetics (some people may be genetically more likely to get some illnesses than others) to lifestyle choices, environmental factors etc. As to what the reason behind unfairness in life is - who really knows ? There are loads of differing theories. All I know is that I do believe that everyone has some sort of "cross" to bear in some shape or form - whether it be pain (physical or mental), illness, death, disappointment, loneliness etc.

Hi Space Cadet.

I think it was my posting you are referring to. I know exactly what you mean. It's hard to understand why there are monsters out there, murderers and the like, who live a long and healthy lives (even if it’s in prison or not). When on the other hand you have good honest law abiding people who are taken at a young age and are missed to the point where it can have a devastating effect on the people they leave behind.

Maybe it’s one of those ‘is there a God’ questions? I’m not sure, but that question always comes up when lovely people die doesn’t it?

I remember asking a priest ‘why does God lets good people die’? and he said, ‘God is testing us’. I said ‘what for’ and he said ‘all of your life is a test’

Is that an answer?

that kinda buys into the idea that our life, now is like being in school and before we graduate we have to pass certain stages, lessons to learn. but it is hard when someone young dies with so much to look forward to and to leave a young family behind, so sad maybe one of the hardest lessons to learn

My mum died of cancer when I was ten and it took many many years to be able to accept it. I remember asking that kind of question and I can't remember who it was, but someone told me that God must have an important job to do and only my Mum was good enough to do it as God picks the best people to join him first.
To be honest it didn't help me accept it, but it was a nice explanation for a child.

when you lose a parent it is so hard but to lose one at ten i caanot imagne how that felt, you really need your mum when you are growing up. i lost mine when i was 30 infact it is the18 aniversey tomorrow so she is in my mind alot at the moment

:hippy:Space Cadet,

I Like others have suffered many losses in my life time. my nain, my mother. friends children and the most painful my husband 2 years ago. i have asked the question why the young always get taken first.
but the answer i came to was that the young honest people are only loaned to us for a short time, to help us learn a lesson.

for children who get taken to soon i always tell the people involved that jesus wanted a special angel to sit at his side, for adults my father in law for instance was a keen gardner when he passed over i told my husband that a good gardner was wanted for the gardens of heaven.

life is very difficult very often and some travel through with no problems ,not me i have just come out of hospital having had 2 operations, i have another 2 to go that will yake me to 19 operations in my life, so far and all i have ever done is help people.

take care

I don't know why, Space Cadet. It is just possible that terrible things happen whether or not you're good or bad. Terrible things just are. Good things just are, too. I don't think there is a connection with bad stuff and the soul-state of a person. It's maybe just the nature of life in the physical world. Things go wrong sometimes. Things break down, people get sick, people have suffering. Also, things work sometimes too, things shine, things are joy-filled.
I do not know what the pattern of events is all about.

I can understand exactly how you feel. My hubby was not a young man when he died (78) but he had a very young personality and still had much to offer the world.
But we lost a step daughter at 28 years old,by her own hand. That was devastating.
I remember when hubby was in hospital one time,there was a young wife and mother in the bed opposite to him. She could have been no more than early 40's. I remember the day she died,her husband and teenage children were brought in. They drew the screens and the sound of her husband crying broke my heart! What a waste of life to such a terrible illness.

Sometiems bad things happen to good people maybe because they were not a good person in their past life and in this life they have to pay for it. I tried to be a good person and not many good things happen to me. I don't have a good life, but each day is a gift that is why it's call the present.

Dear Space Cadet,

This is a question that philosophers, theologians and all thinkers have struggled with throughout the ages.

One thing I would say though is that a long life (thinking about people who have caused others harm) does not equate to happiness and fulfilment. I deeply believe that all sin will destroy itself and if not repented of, the method is through suffering – whether in this life, or in the next. We all have to shed what is un-Godlike in order to re-connect to who we really are and we will be forced to grow spiritually, because God is Love and perfection is the law of Love.

Why good people suffer is a completely different question. The way I see it, is that the whole world believes that we are vulnerable mortals, born into matter to die out of it, with good and bad and possibly much suffering often along the way. People believe that there is good luck and bad luck (and you can’t have one without the other) people believe that they are hopeless victims of chance, of birth. What we believe in, we bring into our experience and in fact, unless we are aware of it, we can even get influenced by the general beliefs in world-thought, without consciously thinking them ourselves.

What I do know is that this is not the way it is meant to be.

I speak from my background as a student of Christian Science, but many individuals, from all different religions and philosophies throughout history, have glimpsed a higher light, a higher consciousness. Many, from the Hebrew prophets onwards have healed the sick, raised the dead, provided supply where there was lack, and overturned every single other limitation of so-called material “law” including the law of eternal bondage called Karma!

(see )

Jesus didn’t come to found a new version of Judaism, but to show mankind a new way of thinking and living that frees us from all the limitations and sufferings of matter. Unfortunately, his real mission became hidden under layers of tradition, ritualism, dogma, but the Principle behind his great works is eternal and universal and is just as powerful today as it was 2,000 years ago.

Mary Baker Eddy wrote:

(Jesus) annulled the laws of matter, showing them to be laws of mortal mind, not of God. He showed the need of changing this mind and its abortive laws. He demanded a change of consciousness and evidence, and effected this change through the higher laws of God ………….. Jesus required neither cycles of time nor thought in order to mature fitness for perfection and its possibilities. He said that the kingdom of heaven is here, and is included in Mind (a synonym for God) (Unity of Good p 11)

At Christmas I started a thread called “Does God send suffering?” and there is a wonderful healing of a baby born disabled. Is life fair? This healing shows we don’t have to accept that premise!

(and Serendipity I've attempted to answer your priest's "test" answer on it too)

This article below is about how a young woman turned away from her religion because she felt that God didn’t answer prayer, but when her understanding changed, there were remarkable results!:

[url]Now my heart sings[/url]

One day, humanity will embrace this higher understanding of Being and suffering and limitation will be unknown.

Love and peace,

Judy

A cynic might say there is no reason that life should be fair. An optimist might prefer the concept of karma that says if you are unlucky or badly treated in one life then your next life will be better. I'm with the optimists!

well in that case i must have a good life next but i would sure like a taste of it now, but i know compared to others our life in the west is a luxury and we should not winge so we better get on with it.

That's life....................

There is nothing like unfair in this world...
The Universe is our Creator, the Place where we live and does Justice to us.

There is nothing like somebody's too soon death.

These all are only in human messy, distrusting, self-destroying chaotic minds that are scared to stop thinking for a while...

If you want to know why are you in the place where you are just shut your mouth up, shut your mind up and listen to yourself...

Just be with yourself...

The answer will come...not immediately...don't expect that...

Just quiet down...and you will get the answer...to all your questions of existence...

Its really easy...

I have also been there...posing all these questions...just like you all...sometimes feeling sorry for myself and for the ones i loved. There is no point in doing it all...

The only thing you can and should do is to be silent and listen...to your breath and a heartbeat...

With love

Bea

Hello Bes,

I haven't seen you on HP before, so welcome from me! There is a sentence in your post above that I find deeply troubling. I know that many religions and philosophies explain away death by saying it's God's will, it's our time etc and here you are saying just that too:

There is nothing like somebody's too soon death.

Try saying that to the grieving parents of a young child! I simply can't buy into that belief. Jesus came and healed the sick and raised the dead - if death was part of the great plan, then why did (and could he) he do that? I mentioned above that I am a student of Christian Science - over the past 130+ years tens of thousands of people who have been given terminal diagnoses have been healed through understanding prayer - a prayer that begins as its basis with the fact that God is Life itself and Life's will is never for death!

The link I gave above "Now my heart sings" includes bringing a still-born puppy to life and here below are some other healings of conditions expected to be terminal:

[url]My premonition was a call for healing prayer[/url]

[url]Why it's never too late[/url]

[url]My journey from terminal to joyful and healthy[/url]

I rest my case. 😉

Love and peace,

Judy

Buddhists like myself believe in rebirth and that different karmic imprints create different types of people.

We have to try to let go of our loved ones when they die, although its hard. We all have to die, young or old, nobody can determine the length of our lives, this is the nature of life on this planet.

This is why we should do the best we can with our own lives right now and give all living beings as much loving kindness and compassion as we can.

I believe everyone who lives will have some sort of 'pain' throughout their lives.
We all question 'why' and how come it always happens to the 'nice' people. Trouble is it doesnt. I am sure all the 'bad' people have trauma in their lives too.
Not that i have any sympathy for these people, and some may say its just deserved.
The fact that people die young is in fact tragic, i like to think that they are special, because of this they are needed earlier than most.
Maybe they have something else to do.
There are no answers to it all no matter how much we search.

The Eastern logicians say you have to keep creating good karma or merit to keep your head above water. Indian Philosophy is such an interesting (err ... infuriating?) mixture of irrefutable logic and superstitious faith! It has no bottom (unlike the FTSE)!

You follow natural law or dharma and then get hit by a truck ... 's Amazin! Perhaps there was a cause somewhere in distant time ... some harm we perpetrated? If so, could knowing there WAS a cause be of some comfort to us now? Some use?

If we follow the Lords Prayer, "... forgive us our tresspasses" are we liberated from the results our past Karma?

I'm framing the debate as a question because ... I don't know.
When the stream of logic drys up you'r left with your own faith!

The way it is

I'm framing the debate as a question because ... I don't know.
When the stream of logic drys up you'r left with your own faith!

I think there's more to your question than meets the eye.

Look at cause and effect: Like Newton's third law. Every action has and equal and opposite reaction. One discrete object acts with a discrete force on another discrete object. What do we have? a universe of complete determinacy. It goes on like a clock until it has completely run down. Entropy has exhausted all energetic gradients. So what then? Clearly a Newtonian deterministic universe is a very useful model but it doesn't explain where everything came from. Everything is conserved yet ends in universal stagnation.

When we look at phenomena we see consistencies that appear to suggest some kind of predictability of cause and effect and in fact Newton's third law is very useful. If it weren't for our using this law there wouldn't be much in the way of machinery in the world for us to make life easier. However, if you accept that there such a law functions in the universe you must also accept that some events are unpredictable; are random and indeterminate.

Einstein didn't like this too much when Hiesenburg suggested that uncertainty was built into the deep fabric of the universe when he said:"God doesn't play dice."

What if we look at complex things. They seem to follow patterns but there seems to be infinite variation. Again there seems to be order and chaos mixed up all over the place. And chaos seems to find patterns too... layer upon layer of order with liberal spreadings of unpredictability.

Of course, all of this is just analysis of things that are defined as things. If we realise that "every thing" is just our idea of "something" and that it is just a word we put on it and that ever thing is constantly changing in an infinite flux of coming and going we have "no-thing" in the space of awareness that has no dimension. Then what is cause? Then what is seen by who?

I wouldn't use the word faith but it does seem there is a force of intention with understanding that we can become more and more acquainted with through recognising the "selfless" nature of being; letting go of clinging to self definition. Paradoxically this gives us a kind of certainty of an uncreated reality that is inseparable with the way things are; seem to be; become.

What a load of nonsense!

Norbu

I have no idea what the answer is, a few weeks ago I lost a dear friend, who was young, full of life, who lit up the room when she walked into, she was full of laughter a friend to everyone, but she got up in the middle of the night, we have no idea why and then she fell down the stairs! That's it, her life has ended but the anguish for her husband, her two small children, parents, family and friends will continue ............

Just the previous week I lost an elderly aunt, who had lived a long, full and productive life, she passed away peacefully .........

Then last week someone I knew also fell, but again had, a long and happy life .........

I have no answers to the questions but feelings escalate with the age of the person, circumstances, emotions are more acute if someone is young and hasnt experienced a full life, but may be they had lived their life?

Who knows, all I know is life is fragile, we must all live life to the full with respect for ourselves and those around us.

Take care everyone

Fudge
xxx

Sorry if I upset anyone, but we have had some very challenging few weeks, on top of all the usual stuff we need to deal with, my husband even forgot he did have serious health problems, because he was dealing with so many other people who's circumstances are far worse than his!

Take each day as it comes, make the most of it as who knows what is going to happen tomorrow!

Take care

Fudge
xxx

No idea

I think you are right Fudge,

We can't really have any idea in the end. In the end all we can have is compassion for our own suffering and the suffering of others. Somehow out of this universal compassion something, I believe, does make sense.

It is true, we do not know when the end can come and all the more reason for seeing things clearly now. And, at least from a Buddhist point of view, this has to be based on finding compassion in our hearts and letting go of fixed ideas of how we thought things should have been: Just wishing for happiness and the causes of happiness for all.

Take care,

Norbu

:grouphug: Fudge :grouphug:

I Know more than most that life is fragile, i to have been through a horrendous 5 years, something that i would not like to go through ever again, life is not easy neither is it fair,
i always said that life is hell on earth. and i still stick to that,
but i also know that if you carry anger around in you it will only destroy you, because forgiveness is something that some find very hard to do, including myself. but to forgive is devine, and then the healing can begin,
we are all on a path of learning and life is better when we can all smile.

take care

Bring me more pain, bring me greater hardships, send me tumbling down the river that I may be worn smooth against the rocks. 🙂

Bring me more pain, bring me greater hardships, send me tumbling down the river that I may be worn smooth against the rocks. 🙂

zanshincentre, thank you for sharing.
I have returned many many times today to read your words.
There is great beauty, depth and comfort in these words.
Thank you so much for sharing.

Comfort?

I find no comfort in those words!

As for the beauty and depth, where is is?

Please explain!

Fudge

Fudge, I think this has been the very most difficult year of my life so far.
No I havent had some of the most terrible things happen to me like they can, but it still has been terribly difficult. I am now divorced, relocating to a new area to accomodation I can afford and also trying to find work in this area and more than anything trying to find a reason for living. Some days, the reason has been to feed my cats and say hello to them.

Yesterday I realised that I have been unable to feel. I have been sort of numb and I didn't realise till yesterday. The words that I read by zanshincentre just meant something to me.
I have been in a numb place unable to feel. I am hoping that now the knowing of the pain can allow the healing. I thought I was alright.

That is why the words gave me comfort, for in the acknowledgment of my hurt can begin the transformation into Love and the words of zanshincentre reminded me of the tumbling flow of streams as they pass on their way down the mountainside and it would be so so good for my sharpness of my personal NO to be smoothed into acceptance of where I am now.

Fudge, I hope my reply does answer some of your questions.....the words helped me. I am going for a walk today to look at the waterfallls and see how the water flows over the smooth rocks and when I look at the flowing water I see great beauty and depth and was just reminded of this when I read the words.

I hope this explains a little.

Hello Fudge,

I have a very good friend who lost her son as a toddler. She was unable to find peace until she realized that a lifetime is as long as we live!

For some of us that is 90+ years.
For some it is merely a few days.
For many it is the 50+ years that provide the statistics to find an average.

Some retain the sharp edges and never attain the smoothness and symmetry that living can provide. Some are easily worn away. Some strain against the forces of life and prolong the strain and pain. Some act as agent of change.

However many days or years we have, we live our lifetime. May we live it well and find joy wherever we are!