BULLYING

RE: BULLYING

Mindmagic

well thanks for coming here and sharing your situation. That alone at times takes courage; so well done.

Now, that situation is actually very familiar to me as my youngest was also bullied in her former school several times and we again did exactly what you have done and were told exactly the same things.

Well, I do not know if if I have/had any magic answers but i want to briefly share what i did and what i may suggest you do too, if that is oif any help to you and your daughter.

I think we need to start from the reality and that is that it always takes two to create an argument. Sure the bully may be mostly to blame but my youngest (Naomi) was in fact a bit "too" sensitive just as much as the other girl attacking (verbally only, thank goodness) was a real troble maker.

The other reality check is that in life we always come across trouble makers. And though, sure, we hope that our kids will come to experiense that as late as p[ossible the reality is that at times they have to at a very early age. Naomi was bullied when she was 12, so a little bit oldfer than yours but still it hurts and wounds deeply both emotionally and in their outlook on life.

Sorry I am going a long way here bit i think it is important to explain that there certain situation we can control (our kids) and certain situations that we may not be able to control or at least not fully.

My course of action with Naomi was in three ways:

1. I tried to build her self-confidence
She is a bit overweight for her size and she does have a problem on this. This was by the way the bullying. That meant spending time with her, coaching her, making see and feel how great she was/is despite those exctra pounds. I had to really impress her that what ever one kid was thinking of her weight she was beautiful and precious in the eyes of her parents and of so many other people who love her. Raise her awarenes that weight is not related to her abilities and that she can do what ever she wants.

2. I dealt with her over sensitive attitude
This meant "coaching" her to become more "tough" in front of life situations and to raise her awareness that in life there are some great and lovely people and there are some b****** people. I brough her to realise that in life some people will love her and some people, for what ever reason, will hate her. But life must go on! She would need to learn to become more resilient to life obstacles and bruises and when ever someone would say something unpleasant... let it rub off you. I told her to not even listen when that girls said the horrible things she was saying and be strong.

3. I trained her to love her enemies
This may seem the most difficult and in fact it is. I coached her to love the bullying girl and to be nice and plesant to her if the opportunity arose. The amazing thing is that this opportunity did in fact arise and the girl, the bullying girl, actually apologised for her comments over the previous months. Amazing eh?

One more thing to encourage you with. Just love your daughter as never before. Stand with her through this trial. The clouds may have gathered right now but believe me... they will go away and the sun will shine again. Encourage her and yourslf to stand in front of the bullying kid and mother with your head high, not returning the bullying or the accusations but with dignity and genuine pride that you do not go down to such stupid things such as those.

I know I have more to say but i stop here for now and will come back later. Also perhaps someone else may want to share their experience.

RE: BULLYING

Hi mindmagic

I feel for your daughter. Two of my girls were bullied at school, and was constantly harrassed at home. We too informed the school of everything - and I mean everything!! WE warned them of trouble coming into the school, we warned them of threats, but they did nothing. This went on for a year, then another threat was made for my girls to be beaten up. They were!! WE were the ones who phoned the police, and WE were the ones who informed the school. But it ended with all parties being excluded for a week!! We also contacted our MP. She was ok, but really didnt do much for us. We even went through mediation with this family, but even they was what kind of people they were, and really couldnt do much more.

All I can suggest is that you be firmer with the school. Gather all parents who's children are being bullied and all of you go to complain. Send your daughter to a self defence class - I sent mine to learn kickboxing. It gave them some confidence, and telling the instructor of your story helps. My girls havent used their kickboxing skills yet, but if it came to, they know how to defend themselves, and feel more confident in standing up to the bully. And they did! At the end of the day, most bullies are jealous for what ever reason, or have something to hide about their life, so in order to hide this, they have this 'tough look' trying to be popular by being a bully. This is all it is. Your daughter is a wonderful girl, and with a loving mother like you, and all the support you will get here, i'm sure she will be fine.

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RE: BULLYING

Well you are so right,both of you. I have just found out that the childs grandmother is just as shouty and aggressive as the mother and daughter.I just pray that this incident may break the chain annd that the mother will realise
what she is doing to her daughter.Have unleashed archangels onto the case so am expecting a miracle!!!
In a way I am glad that I received some of the nastiness so that I can show Emma not to be intimidated by *********.It has also made me realise that I need to be a lot more confident so that I am a good role model for her,but Im not really good at that yet.
We have decided we are both going to karate!
Just to let anyone know if you are having a similar problem,look at the kidscape
website and call them,they help a lot with your rights as parents
May the force be with us
mindmagic

RE: BULLYING

Letter to a bully…

You come in so many guises, we do not always recognise you,
Sometimes you are subtle and other times brutal,
You so desperately want to feel good, be the centre of attention,
And do not know how to,
So in order to feel “big”, you try to make others look “small”.

You know very well that on your own,
You would go by, practically unnoticed,
So you hunt in pack, with your “pals”, the ones that are so afraid of you,
They want your approval, so they pretend to be as tough as you,
And would do whatever is necessary, in order to escape being attacked by you.

You really do not care who you stand on,
You really do not care who’s heart you are making bleed,
You really do not care about who’s Soul you are fragmenting,
You just go and attack any one that looks like an easy target,
And looks and age don’t worry you either, all you want is a “feel good” quick-fix.

How you came to be a bully, only you can answer,
But let me assure you, that whatever the reason,
The pain and emptiness in your heart and soul,
Will not go away and be healed by abusing another.

I pray that you open your heart, even just a little,
And hear the cries of the mother, who’s child you have just beaten,
Feel the pain you have carved in the soul of your victims,
Open your heart and feel, that you too are a victim,
And know that you can heal the pain, by just loving yourself a little more.

It is not too late…you can do it.

~~~

Domestic Violence and Kuan Yin's Prayer for the Abuser

No woman or child anywhere under any circumstances deserves to be abused, be it physically, emotionally or financially. No matter how bad it seems you are NOT alone. There are national helplines available in all countries through the world.

Women's Aid Federation of England
[link] http://www.womensaid.org.uk [/link]
Helpline 08457 023 468

Domestic and Family Violence can be:
Physical abuse: Hitting, punching, kicking, and shoving.
Emotional abuse: Making you feel worthless, criticising your personality, you looks, the way you dress, constantly putting you down, threatening to hurt you, your children or your pets.
Verbal abuse: Yelling, swearing at you, name calling to hurt or embarrass you.
Financial abuse: Pressuring you to hand over your money, not giving you enough money to meet your basic needs, taking control of the shared money.
Social abuse: Controlling where you go, keeping you in the house, not letting you see your friends or family.
Spiritual abuse: Telling you or others that you are evil, crazy or mad when you tell the truth or act out of moral integrity, forbidding you to partake in your religion or religious group, calling your beliefs crap or nonsense.
Sexual abuse: Forcing you to have sex when you don't want to.

~~~

Kuan Yin's Prayer for the Abuser

To those who withhold refuge,
I cradle you in safety at the core of my Being.
To those that cause a child to cry out,
I grant you the freedom to express your own choked agony.
To those that inflict terror,
I remind you that you shine with the purity of a thousand suns.
To those who would confine, suppress, or deny,
I offer the limitless expanse of sky.
To those who need to cut, slash or burn,
I remind you of the invincibility of Spring.
To those who cling and grasp,
I promise more abundance than you could ever hold onto.
To those who vent their rage on small children,
I return to you your deepest innocence.
To those who must frighten into submission,
I hold you in the bosom of your original mother.
To those who cause agony to others,
I give the gift of free flowing tears.
To those that deny another's right to be,
I remind you that the angels sang in celebration of you on the day of your birth.
To those who see only division and separateness,
I remind you that a part is born only by dissecting a whole.
For those who have forgotten the tender mercy of a mother's embrace,
I send a gentle breeze to caress yo

RE: BULLYING

Nooria

thank you for your contribution.

Let's come back though to the issue at stake which is bullying. Please share your experiences and how you are dealing with it/are trying to deal with it. I mean physical or verbal bullying. After all they are the same in the emotional effects on the kid.

RE: BULLYING

Hi guys

I need to personally at least disagree with some of the comments made above.

Reacting with physical violence to physical violence is not really a solution but an emotional reaction. Yes, I know that some of our kids get beaten up and the whole lot that goes with it and why should they and what can they do about it.

But what you are suggesting, or seem to suggesting, is the old phylosophy of an eye for an eye. Personally I disagree and just think this is not really the right way to go through the problem. And what are we then saying to our kinds, that violence is ok? What example are we setting for them?

There are much better ways and we can certainly discuss on those.

RE: BULLYING

Hi Alex

I'm not suggesting that kids should react to physical violence (this is done by the bully). I'm saying that if the child was able to defend him/herself, or build up some kind of confidence, it makes the situation easier. If a child is sensitive in the first place, the last thing he/she needs is for the bully to keep picking on him/her because he/she is an easy target. By sending your child to a self defence class, it not only teaches them how to defend themselves (for the unevitable), but how to build up their confidence in facing someone like an attacker or just a bully. I am talking through experience too.

Sometimes in some situations, there is a need for, 'eye for an eye!' I've bought my girls up to respect their elders and never raise a fist. But in our experiences, we have learnt that sometimes you have to give back what you recieve, whether it be verbal or physical.
Everybody is different!

For a start, physical is a strong word, i'm not suggesting that if a bully starts on you, then its ok to kick the daylights out of him/her.
But i feel that at some point, it is necessary to show the bully you are able to stand up to them, other wise it carries on. If the bully was to push the kid, I feel it is necessary for that kid to push back as long as there are no injuries. This can then be followed by talk (verbal).

It is showing the bully, you're not to be messed with. By telling the bully you do not like what he/she is doing, telling them it upsets you, and by telling them you will not stand for it any longer. Basically being strong! But this doesnt always work - as we now know!! But not all kids can do this. Hence build up of confidence.

I have to leave this for now, it is going to be a very interesting subject indeed. Will continue soon

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RE: BULLYING

I agree with Michelle on many points...

... if the child was able to defend him/herself, or build up some kind of confidence, it makes the situation easier.

... a self defence class, it not only teaches them how to defend themselves (for the unevitable), but how to build up their confidence in facing someone like an attacker or just a bully.

But in our experiences, we have learnt that sometimes you have to give back what you recieve, ...

it is necessary to show the bully you are able to stand up to them, showing the bully, you're not to be messed with... other wise it carries on.

By telling the bully you do not like what he/she is doing, and by telling them you will not stand for it any longer.

There is a big difference in attacking someone and defending yourself.

I am talking through experience too.

RE: BULLYING

Hi all

Another point i'd like to make is no matter how much we teach our children the rights and wrongs, and how well they turn out - there will always be bullies around no matter what.

RE: BULLYING

I agree with what Michelle has said. Bullys WILL always be around, all we are doing is helping to protect our children as much as we can.

RE: BULLYING

hi guys

I know that there are different ideas among us but I just want to clarify something, just in case I may have given wrong impressions or confused messages.

Personally I hate any form of physical or verbal violence, whether it is attacking or self-defence. The use of verbal or physical force, however you want to colour it, it is the use of force. I can understand the reasons of the victims of bullying; but for me it is always a form of "force". I prefer always to discuss things and to try and find a "peaceful", non-violent form to solve the issues. But that is me and I do not expect everyone else to agree with me.

When Naomi was bullied at school that is what we did (read the story in my posting above). No violence, no force but simple action starting with naomi and then with the school and that sent powewrful messages to the whole school community, let alone to the bully and her family.

Above all what is important for me, and thank goodness for my kinds too, is that we learn to love our enemies. That worked in her case; it may be different for other people.

RE: BULLYING

Michelle

you said...

no matter how much we teach our children the rights and wrongs, and how well they turn out - there will always be bullies around no matter what.

What a great truth! And that is in part my point above. You can chose to keep fighting bullies all ytour life OR you can chose to walk away from bullies (where ever possible) and ... love them all the same!

RE: BULLYING

Hi Alex

You can chose to keep fighting bullies all ytour life OR you can chose to walk away from bullies

I understand this all too well, but what happens when you constantly walk away (ignoring them), and all they do is persist. Some instances, this does happen. Some bullies don't like people walking away from them, they feel insulted. So its a vicious cirlce again.

RE: BULLYING

Hi Alex

I do understand what you are saying. But what if people wont listen what then

My daughter was bullied, were i could not get her to school, i used to find her sitting in the garage crying when i thought she was at school, to scared to go in.
I took my daughter back to school and she would not get out the car. The teacher came out and told her not to come in for a few days as she was to emotional. Went back and had a meeting and was told the girl was like this because she had a bad home life and was jealous of Lucy. I had no support from the school. I have since then tought Lucy not to be violent but to verbaly stand up for herself. This has helped her and increased her confidence.

RE: BULLYING

Hi All

I had no support from the school. I have since then tought Lucy not to be violent but to verbaly stand up for herself

This happens to often for my liking. The schools project how much bullying is such an important issue, yet they don't seem to know how to handle the situations when they arise. I don't know about what others think, but from my experiences, the school was more interested in their reputation rather than their students.

RE: BULLYING

I am also against physical violence, but sadly sometimes one must defend onesself and the only thing the to do is actually hit back, i prefer the pacifist route and have always said the same to my kids, but there have been times when it got to bad and would not stop so I told my son to stay put and fight as hard as he could, he did and that was it he was left alone. As I said I prefer the peaceful solution and would advocate it anytime but there are situations where it won't work and in self-defence it just has to be otherwise sometimes.

Rocky.

RE: BULLYING

Hi guys

just got this article from a friend and I had to post it straight away. So, here it goes...

Choosing sides

by Zig Ziglar

One of my favourite stories concerns a young lad who was confronted by three bullies with violence in mind. Quickly the little guy drew a line on the ground, stepped back several feet, looked the biggest bully in the eye and said, "Now, you just step over that line." Confidently, the big bully stepped over the line, preparing to commit mayhem on the little guy. Quickly the little fellow grinned and said, "Now we're both on the same side." Physically, they were both on the same side. But emotionally they were still some little distance apart. The smaller boy improved his chances of getting on the same side emotionally by his touch of wit and wisdom.

This is an excellent combination to diffuse most crisis situations and represents a major step in solving whatever problems exist. There are several lessons parents, managers and educators can learn from this little vignette.

First, whether it is a parent/child, management/labour or teacher/student situation, both really are on the same side and the best way for either side to win is for both sides to win.

Second, a sense of humour can be very helpful in removing communications barriers by revealing your human side and establishing rapport.

Third, sometimes it's necessary for the big bully (the person in authority) to move to the other side of the table (across the line). This lets associates, children or employees clearly understand that they really are on the same side and open to listening to ideas from both sides of that line.

The fourth message is that it is always important to maintain our perspective by being open and fair-minded as we look at life from the other person's perspective.

For who ever might be interested
For further info on Zig Ziglar go to

RE: BULLYING

I would just like to make a quick comment on what Michelle said earlier...

I'm not suggesting that kids should react to physical violence (this is done by the bully). I'm saying that if the child was able to defend him/herself, or build up some kind of confidence, it makes the situation easier.

when I was younger I was bullied by a group of girls - they used to follow me around, waiting for me, threatening to "beat me up" if they saw me alone.

I joined Bushido, self-defence class and it helped enourmously. The best thing about self-defence is that they do teach you confidence, but they also teach you tactics on how to block punches - stop knife attacks, they even taught me what to do if someone came up behind me & pulled my hair! You can learn these things without actually having to physically harm anyone. Obvioulsy they do teach you attacking techniques but with that they teach that you can only use them in "Life threatening" circumstances.

It helped stop my fear of the bullies and as sad as it is, this day in age you never know when you may need to protect yourself.

RE: BULLYING

Hi Alex & everyone

That was a good article and good example you posted.
In some cases, this may work, but it all depends on what kind of bully you have. Now in the above situation, you say there is 3 bullies. Most times there is only one bully with some 'tag alongs' (I call them). They are only there for the bullies support, nothing else. It also depends on how much of a bully that bully is. If you come across one that is only name calling with the occasional push here and there, then I would agree with using the above example.
BUT, if you came across a bully that doesnt let up no matter what, I wouldnt agree with the above example. The reason why, is that my daughter (after her self-defence classes) decided to use a bit of humor (one, because it helped her feel stronger, but two, because she thought it would help the situation). Well it didnt, in fact all it did was to get her head punched several times for being (bullies words) 'cocky'.

Everyone would love to be able to work situations out calmfully and peacefully, hence why we tried mediation. But even this didnt work, the bullies family insulted the volunteers and showed their anger (which wasnt allowed). It all depends on what kind of people you are dealing with!!

I have made my point about schools, so I wont go there again. But if you are lucky in finding that your school is co-operative, good for you, and your child.

When you do the right things to protect your child against bullies, you dont always get the support you need. In fact, most cases and most authorities will not even bat an eyelid to help. I know because we involved the school, the police, our local MP, the governors of the school (who backed the headteacher), mediation (who really were the ones that could see what was happening - but could not do anything), and even the director of education. Even the council was informed because we found out that this family was being evicted from the house they were in (which was 2 minutes from ours - for not paying their rent). But although the council was aware of the situation, they housed this family 5 minutes away from us!!!
Although all these people could see the injuries that was inflicted on my girls, the harm caused mentally to our family, not one of them helped us.

So what do you do in cases like this?

RE: BULLYING

Hello Friends,

Flip! This reminds me of my time at school, or at least part of it. I was bullied at school for being 'too clever' and getting full marks in spelling tests! Yeah! Talk about inadequate people! The bullies would wait for me at playtime and home time, and wouldn't leave me alone until I began to cry. Every day at school was a blinking chore, a task to be got through.

Like most of you, my mum had no joy with the school. She complained to the council and the Director of Education, still no joy. So she kept me off school until the headmaster et al was prepared to do something about it. Luckily enough, the bullies were persecuting other children, and the authorities had to take notice. The main bully was expelled and the others left the primary school to attend secondary schools anyway. My son was never bullied at school.

Bullying goes on everywhere, not just at school. I used to work for a manager who didn't like me because I wasn't a 'dolly bird' even though I could do the job efficiently and to deadlines. He wouldn't even call me by my name, wouldn't look at me and used to find any excuse to 'have a go' at me. I left.

I would agree with Alex that meeting violence with violence is no solution. It just makes it worse. The bullies whom I mentioned above, couldn't 'get enough' of one girl after it became known that she had taken up judo. They just went for her even more, trying to goad her into using her skills on them. Assertiveness training, confidence, a sense of humour and a willingness to 'love' them all works, tried and tested. An example: when I first came into my present job, the manager was a near-ogre - shouting, getting wound up, swearing and picking on us. I thought, 'I'm not putting up with this.' I used to end up dreading what sort of day I'd have. The others lived in fear of Andrew, and kept warning me about him and his tempers, etc. and not to tempt him into them. Anyway, I began to really befriend him, smiling at him when I saw him, offering him cuppas, cakes, sweets and sharing a joke or talking about stories in the news, and music that we both liked. We became friends, even though he was my manager, he became a lot easier to handle. The others were quite impressed, and I began to like Andrew. Whereas before he would fly into a temper if we mentioned any of his errors or shortcomings, he would now laugh alongside us because we made a joke of them, and saying, 'We're just as bad!' Eventually, this friendship evolved into something more, and we became lovers. Even though Andrew has left now, we are still in touch and still in love, and he is a totally different manager now to his new staff, to what he was back then. Proof positive that a little love, affection, humour and understanding can work wonders with the fiercest bully, not to mention a little bit of 'mothering'. Andrew was like this because his marriage was breaking down and the wife was using emotional and mental bullying on him, and he was so wound up. Once that was revealed, I took him 'under my wing' and made him my 'pet project.' I even help him to run his cricket club, and we often enjoy going to footie matches now!

The 'positive' approach really does work. Good luck to all of you who are living with bullies or dealing with them. My heart goes out to all of you.

Love,
Patsy.
xxxxx