This was indeed astonishing and very depressing news! Not for nothing did Trump claim to love the 'poorly educated'! Appealing to the lowest common denominator and winning makes my mind reel! Even those in his OWN party are against him.
It is also very worrying since he is not exactly mentally stable/reliable and Hilary Clinton echoed the fear of many re. pressing the nuclear button.
That a man who so clearly sexually abused women and claims that "no one has more respect for women" can still receive more votes than Hilary....why....I am apt to use Trump's words and say it was rigged!
More concerning still is that Russia wanted Trump to win....what the hell is that about!???
However....every cloud....
For those who don't know her - she hates ginger people, single mothers, the unemployed, those with tattoos etc etc etc
We need MORE tolerance in this world, not less!
Much of Trumps campaign rhetoric was just that - rhetoric. He is a wrestling fan and it reminded me of a heel wrestler whipping up the crowd. I think President Trump may well be a very different kettle of fish. I think that has already come out in his speeches since he won. And lord knows the Washington system is even more out of touch than Whitehall is! Maybe an outsider is the best thing that could happen to shake it up and make it actually work!. I am worried about things like the USA pulling out Nato and climate change deals . If he reverses Obamacare and gay marriage no doubt the electorate will speak in 2 and 4 years time ,but those cannot affect us in the UK. I do NOT think he is going to press the nuclear button on a whim
That a man who so clearly sexually abused women and claims that "no one has more respect for women" can still receive more votes than Hilary....
I don't know if this will make it worse or cheer you up, but Clinton got more votes than Trump. What she didn't get was the backing of the Electoral College.
However....every cloud....For those who don't know her - she hates ginger people, single mothers, the unemployed, those with tattoos etc etc etc
Yes. That would be good news.:D
Much of Trumps campaign rhetoric was just that - rhetoric. He is a wrestling fan and it reminded me of a heel wrestler whipping up the crowd. I think President Trump may well be a very different kettle of fish. I think that has already come out in his speeches since he won. And lord knows the Washington system is even more out of touch than Whitehall is! Maybe an outsider is the best thing that could happen to shake it up and make it actually work!. I am worried about things like the USA pulling out Nato and climate change deals . If he reverses Obamacare and gay marriage no doubt the electorate will speak in 2 and 4 years time ,but those cannot affect us in the UK. I do NOT think he is going to press the nuclear button on a whim
You make some good, balanced appraisals. Trumps does come across as a talented salesman, i.e. pitching what he knows could 'sell'. He's clearly good at the waffle....now let's see if he can walk the talk!
Yes, I too, am worried about him backtracking on the climate change deals....still, 2 months before the man gets into power and some of his own party are against him! Here's hoping he doesn't make it!
I don't know if this will make it worse or cheer you up, but Clinton got more votes than Trump. What she didn't get was the backing of the Electoral College.
I was listening to a discussion on her loss; a male spokesman said that if she was a man she might not have lost!
I was listening to a discussion on her loss; a male spokesman said that if she was a man she might not have lost!
I guess that might be true. But there was never a good choice. The system is always going to re-elect the system, no matter who fronts it.
I just received this via email from an organisation that works to support peace initiatives, particularly in relations between the Middle East and the US — thought there were some helpful ideas here:
[url]When the "Other is here at home [/url]
I am trying with all my heart to bring this lesson home and live it when it hits me deeper, pains me more. When the “Other” is literally my brother, my father, my in-laws, close friends. More and more, I notice that we are seeing leaders and members of another political party as the “Other”. And while outwardly we may not have resorted to bombs and violence, there is violence and hatred in our thoughts against them.
I wonder how I can justify railing against a now-President elect for the way he “Others” people and sows hatred and division. If I hate him and separate myself from the people who support him, I am expressing hatred and division. I am treating them all as Others. I am creating conflict and war.
This is hard and it’s personal. A member of my immediate family’s first reaction to the election results was, “The best next step is…lock her up!” I was stunned and struggling to process that kind of vindictiveness and self-righteousness.
.....
As latent racism, sexism and hatred bubbles to the surface or is emboldened by recent events, it demands even more of us—to stop being complacent, increase our vigilance and care for our neighbor, and most importantly, to not “Other” people who we condemn for “Othering.”
One thing that has helped me do this in the case of even close family members is a friend sharing that any time we experience disconnection—from others, ourselves, or even the planet, we suffer. We may not be conscious of it, but we are suffering deep down. It helped me to find that compassion within myself when I thought of the reason behind someone being hateful, prejudiced, or vindictive, is that they are disconnected and suffering at some level. I can also let go of judgment when I examine myself and see that there are many parts of me which are disconnected and that are suffering. I can have compassion for myself, too, in that same way.
The other thing that is helping me is conversations with other non-profit leaders and friends who have all expressed an increased commitment to heal what is ailing in our society, to reach out and listen with an intent to understand the “Other”, to build bridges, to create a world that is just, equitable, sustainable, and free for all. That is energizing, exciting, and invigorating.
I just received this via email from an organisation that works to support peace initiatives, particularly in relations between the Middle East and the US — thought there were some helpful ideas here:
[url]When the "Other is here at home [/url]
I am trying with all my heart to bring this lesson home and live it when it hits me deeper, pains me more. When the “Other” is literally my brother, my father, my in-laws, close friends. More and more, I notice that we are seeing leaders and members of another political party as the “Other”. And while outwardly we may not have resorted to bombs and violence, there is violence and hatred in our thoughts against them.
I wonder how I can justify railing against a now-President elect for the way he “Others” people and sows hatred and division. If I hate him and separate myself from the people who support him, I am expressing hatred and division. I am treating them all as Others. I am creating conflict and war.
This is hard and it’s personal. A member of my immediate family’s first reaction to the election results was, “The best next step is…lock her up!” I was stunned and struggling to process that kind of vindictiveness and self-righteousness.
.....As latent racism, sexism and hatred bubbles to the surface or is emboldened by recent events, it demands even more of us—to stop being complacent, increase our vigilance and care for our neighbor, and most importantly, to not “Other” people who we condemn for “Othering.”
One thing that has helped me do this in the case of even close family members is a friend sharing that any time we experience disconnection—from others, ourselves, or even the planet, we suffer. We may not be conscious of it, but we are suffering deep down. It helped me to find that compassion within myself when I thought of the reason behind someone being hateful, prejudiced, or vindictive, is that they are disconnected and suffering at some level. I can also let go of judgment when I examine myself and see that there are many parts of me which are disconnected and that are suffering. I can have compassion for myself, too, in that same way.
The other thing that is helping me is conversations with other non-profit leaders and friends who have all expressed an increased commitment to heal what is ailing in our society, to reach out and listen with an intent to understand the “Other”, to build bridges, to create a world that is just, equitable, sustainable, and free for all. That is energizing, exciting, and invigorating.
Fine words but, I'm sorry, developing compassion for someone we have a disconnection with in our lives is one thing but this is a much bigger issue that will have devastating consequences! We are talking about someone who has voiced such gross intolerance of certain groups of people and is about to become President Of America i.e. in a position to create further divide. To be lenient against such hatred is to be a doormat! You are asking to be tolerant of an intolerant situation! Can you not foresee what the consequences of his policy might be, i.e. where we are heading???
Far better that Trump should have healed himself of such hatred because he is in a position now to create so much more suffering. It is a highly regressive situation that is wise not to endorse.
sorry - my post got repeated!
Fine words but, I'm sorry, developing compassion for someone we have a disconnection with in our lives is one thing but this is a much bigger issue that will have devastating consequences! We are talking about someone who has voiced such gross intolerance of certain groups of people and is about to become President Of America i.e. in a position to create further divide. To be lenient against such hatred is to be a doormat! You are asking to be tolerant of an intolerant situation! Can you not foresee what the consequences of his policy might be, i.e. where we are heading???
Far better that Trump should have healed himself of such hatred because he is in a position now to create so much more suffering. It is a highly regressive situation that is wise not to endorse.
Unless I missed it, 'tolerant' was not mentioned. I did not read the passage as saying 'Let's persuade ourselves that Trump's a good guy and be happy he won.' I read it as saying, 'Setting up sides where Trump is on one side and I am on the other is divisive. There is more than enough division in the world. I am not prepared to add to it.'
Unless I missed it, 'tolerant' was not mentioned. I did not read the passage as saying 'Let's persuade ourselves that Trump's a good guy and be happy he won.' I read it as saying, 'Setting up sides where Trump is on one side and I am on the other is divisive. There is more than enough division in the world. I am not prepared to add to it.'
OK my oversight then.
I just received this via email from an organisation that works to support peace initiatives, particularly in relations between the Middle East and the US — thought there were some helpful ideas here:
I wonder how I can justify railing against a now-President elect for the way he “Others” people and sows hatred and division. If I hate him and separate myself from the people who support him, I am expressing hatred and division. I am treating them all as Others. I am creating conflict and war.
The other thing that is helping me is conversations with other non-profit leaders and friends who have all expressed an increased commitment to heal what is ailing in our society, to reach out and listen with an intent to understand the “Other”, to build bridges, to create a world that is just, equitable, sustainable, and free for all. That is energizing, exciting, and invigorating.
I have edited down your post to make it easier for me to address these 2 paragraphs.
You are implying that those who are not behind Trump's policies (e.g. banning Muslims from entering US) hate him! Hate is a very strong word here and covers those who have been seen on the streets protesting against the election result but probably not the majority of those who have reservations against him. To not endorse, i.e. be critical of a proposed course of action is not the same thing at all as to hate someone. A clear distinction needs to be made here. Personally I think very negatively of Trump (i.e. that he is a bigot, racist, sexist, egotist, myopic man but hey...a good salesman!) but I do not hate the man - just have a very low opinion of him. This befits what he stands for.
Furthermore it is important to be critical of someone who is in a position to propagate such hatred and division....the very issues that concern you. To be lenient on him is to be seen to be OK with what he proposes.
I applaud your last paragraph but do you see Trump as expressing 'an increased commitment to heal what is ailing in our society'? He is not listening because he is myopic. I greatly question his humanity and feel it is important to address that which opposes it.
Thankfully his stance will be moderated, by those in high office, should he eventually make it to being the US President.
Amy, I appreciate your views, but I'm not sure why you seem to be addressing these comments and criticisms personally to me ("You are implying...", "I applaud your last paragraph..."). Those paragraphs in green are from the article I linked to in my earlier post (the link is in the title, "When the 'Other' is here at home"). I didn't write it myself and it by no means reflects all my own thoughts on the matter exactly. I merely found it food for thought in a very fraught time and was hoping others here might be interested in it as well.
I don't read the article as suggesting in any way that racism, misogyny or any other forms of bigotry and prejudice should be tolerated or treated leniently. I merely see it as a reminder not to hate the haters in return, so to speak — not to let myself be polarised into an "us vs them" mentality by the same fear and hatred and divisiveness that figures like Trump are playing on. I don't think it's implying at all that all those who disagree with Trump actually hate him, either — just that "othering" those we don't and can't agree with is never a helpful reaction, no matter how tempting it may be. At least, that's how I read it.
I don't hate Trump. I don't hate anyone. But things are at crisis point in the world and not likely to get better anytime soon.
(re: LGBT rights)
(re: Climate)
Although, as far as the climate is concerned, I can't see that Clinton would have been better. She'd pretend, maybe, but it was noticeable that she stopped talking about the climate as soon as she had Sander's endorsement.
I'm not even sure Trump doesn't believe in Climate change - he's trying to get permission to build defences against rising sea-levels to protect his property in the Republic of Ireland. I think he simply doesn't care about anything but power and money.
Amy, I appreciate your views, but I'm not sure why you seem to be addressing these comments and criticisms personally to me ("You are implying...", "I applaud your last paragraph..."). Those paragraphs in green are from the article I linked to in my earlier post (the link is in the title, "When the 'Other' is here at home"). I didn't write it myself and it by no means reflects all my own thoughts on the matter exactly. I merely found it food for thought in a very fraught time and was hoping others here might be interested in it as well.
I don't read the article as suggesting in any way that racism, misogyny or any other forms of bigotry and prejudice should be tolerated or treated leniently. I merely see it as a reminder not to hate the haters in return, so to speak — not to let myself be polarised into an "us vs them" mentality by the same fear and hatred and divisiveness that figures like Trump are playing on. I don't think it's implying at all that all those who disagree with Trump actually hate him, either — just that "othering" those we don't and can't agree with is never a helpful reaction, no matter how tempting it may be. At least, that's how I read it.
Oh OK - sorry for my error. I am not thinking too clearly lately....my mother died Nov 4th so please forgive me.
By 'othering' the implication is demonising and this is akin to targeting, i.e. hating. Which goes back to my main point, i.e. that those who criticise his policies do not necessarily hate him. I don't! I just have an extremely low opinion of the man and dislike him. Hate is the extreme end of that spectrum.
I am all for compassion but, in this case, for it to cloud our sense of discrimination, i.e. the ability to see what is being presented (not to mention its implications) is detrimental and to be regretted.
I don't hate Trump. I don't hate anyone. But things are at crisis point in the world and not likely to get better anytime soon.
(re: LGBT rights)
(re: Climate)Although, as far as the climate is concerned, I can't see that Clinton would have been better. She'd pretend, maybe, but it was noticeable that she stopped talking about the climate as soon as she had Sander's endorsement.
I'm not even sure Trump doesn't believe in Climate change - he's trying to get permission to build defences against rising sea-levels to protect his property in the Republic of Ireland. I think he simply doesn't care about anything but power and money.
As you may know, Trump has called climate change a Chinese hoax....but then he holds a grudge against the Chinese....
As you say, it's all about power and money with him (not to mention his oversized ego!!) 
I am all for compassion but, in this case, for it to cloud our sense of discrimination, i.e. the ability to see what is being presented (not to mention its implications) is detrimental and to be regretted.
Once again, I do not believe that is what the article is suggesting at all; if it was, I wouldn't have posted it.
I'm very sorry to hear of the loss of your mother, Amy — wishing you and your family peace and comfort at this difficult time.
Amy, I'm so sorry to hear of your mother' death. You are in my thoughts.
Amy
Sorry for your loss.
I'm in danger of getting my thread off track here! I will just say that, due to dementia, I feel I lost her years ago....so it has been more bearable than anticipated to cope with the news. That said, grief is unpredictable i.e. can suddenly get floored. She was a sweet, much loved person who lived until she was 95.
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Back on topic - I see that today Putin is trying to normalise US-Russia ties with Trump. That sounds like a good thing....wonder why he thought he couldn't achieve it via Hilary... 
(I don't claim to have good knowledge of US politics though, so maybe the reason is obvious to most).